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£ Z .. ^< . l ' . fii "i ^/ ui Hutu * Jw . HOUSE OF COMMONS . —rnrrVj / . Jt .-ty 12 . NATIONAL PETITION . Mr . ATTWCUD ro . « e 10 brirg fcrvard tt ( XBCtiaE o which b-j had given notice on tie I'uVje * - of the National Petition , lie petition wLict h « tad the lot our to yr . sett on tbr 1-lti June he thei iradto a cerrsin cxtent ; but he toauebt it his dim to « tate s portion &t lea ? t of ¦ what he then > tated . TV-t ^ res * ye ' . incn , unpantfel . d in tie Parlianreit * rr liytory cf England , vw occasioned bv the lon ^ Kofiprog . ir . e -srorgs an 4 injuries of the wcriim . daises—iot ct ! y of the working claspea and th worlsne-B , bet ot tbe isdesiricus cta ^ ses -gfaeraiiT . ftesKTchnnt ^ . tV . e manufacturer * , ihe trade : men . tfee iareer * . and the hbsurers . For the last twtnt \ years , the industrious classes had not had corcmon ^** . . j I i t ~\ I ^ i iri 1 ll / i 1 . -f «
TOj * i « S or common humanity shown to them . T"hose in Birmingham had presented rc 3 ny petition s yesraJter year to the House , but they Led been di > - rec * rde !? , j-nd by seme strange fatality the Hoes-: l » dre- u >«? d to listen to their piayere . They had re&arA to listen to ihem in 1816 , lSl » ,= ead 1825 , a * ] TCfl&a Xiion m&ny othf-r cecasifiLg when the indestno « scla ¥ ^< ha 6 ccBnplainedo ! bittergr i ''« u : ce 5 i . Thi AJeaibtrs of that House themselves being ia thciraast cf comfort , and far removed from the wants o ; ¦ ft © * tera Efxes-ities that sfi-cted -the woikinp ehwes , could have no idea o \ tb * ir suffering * , aac attributed their excitement to sc « ie factions Geltmcm « sd to ssitatien . In ccE * fqu : nee of that Bouse krmig tet 1 n-ecjRposed of gentlemen erd ncblpmen t f tbe hi ? he ; -t rark , and pcsse «>? iDg tte greatest
Tsjewtk , « Hi bj tcpir s ' atien « o far rtaaved from thr tower c ! sss-s o ! tie per . &le ss to be xn . acqTi&ii 3 tf > d ¦ with tbfir viiti , thev had legl-lcted in the dark . aad thereby l *» ft them * in a state -of increasing sufi " . ring- This bavin ? been th ^ ir sitnadoc . the Houseeould rot He su-prised that their sufferiBfcs bar generated di « cc :. ? eiit . G'Uid the Hous * imagice tksi the people r-f Ergiand . -who ^ e forefathers btc l >* f I » tbe g- rv cf > Drrc- < 2 i . c : Qg caneu ? , snd iht- raw » f tte werid , sc-i justly * o , because prople brner fed ct bettrr cloth- d c . uld not have iet-c fcurd on fee few cf th « ear ; h , ttat the people -who had tLus Ijeen borne down by st JTeriiips shw : H have betomt * ^ » ccrter : ted ? Cotlc they ce ^ crrri > ed tt hishavicp yre >« rted a petition signed by 1 . 28 » . € ) 0 of tbe people K ^ np ip :-- ' : ¦ -. i «! iLti : ^ ert-re itLffrriL ^ * ? \ Vhate \ -er tt ¦
Sairhtr&v- ' y-. »^ r rne : i . ii-.- -s o ' t ' - « f ^ oTis —an .-. b < - did nst mean to say they had been btc— u . t-1 lTeci of " * rfex had been do ' re iad rot beea beneficial . lr 1829 , "when this agitatioa had eomtBSDced . hiy town * - "SBCSX had applied to Lim . Ho was a man by no 3 UKA& 8 given to change , or who desired exlrtm-. * IBWBreres ; tberefore , he 5 rid to th < ra » n ihat occasioE—Try the tree of the ancient con > ntHfios , End s-ee wheth-. r that i »« ald not bricp icrth the ¦^¦ holesome &rd necessapr ftr . it . They did w » t , Exd tht y cii try ¦» bar could be done in the late ¦ fioose of Parliament in 1 & 2 S . -Uahappilv for tie p ^ cyle . and more -uEba ^ piiy sti ll for the "« af « -ty o ! this rrrjixrj , that h ^ cse cad CT-rrsrdetl ; he praver -tr f fep p ¦• > . T ^ f ^ b-.-i di - - > - _ ..-u •• i-. i rhauhe means ¦
< rf llielr ^^ . u > w , i ^ u ^ i .. > . ?> r » -h-ul b- H ted Lp so ns to le adequate " l : } -lt Loiuei-i , cr nut tLri : L ^; jei ; > « hoBlI be redeced to tr . eir mfans . Tie fToE . ie told ¦ fcfJBtL . y -. rrv- ii-le . and dt sir .-ni tuf m tf e ^ t back "to tbeir birden * . They vrc-r > toll lia . t somed tLtic iept fenr wbee ' ed carriaEe * . and ¦ wrre bettrr cii tbjmthey orr ^ htto be . Then i : was-iat thcT formed a PcHrical L ' riorj . frrm -srhifb tbe pT- ' inion -which br bed 7 > re ^ nted rn ths 14 : h cf J une had r > hginaud . ( Hesr , bear , hear . ) But ahhcr . gh th ¦ petniuss oi fhe p « -oplr bad 5 vr a li-T : s tim- br-en K ) nfrerly unat"tOKiedto . he w . nli no : cie ; y tl at tbere w ; v * « \ ir ' . nr ie tbe Ijoti ^ oi Ccn : inr > n .-. becf'Use ibf p : oji-lehac cert » ir : ly » ucret-d a in carry tlr Reicm ; Bill ttrooeb it . B ^ i vrh ^ iba : te- n the irni : cf ih ? llelcrm Hiii
The first f'uit i : bore ^ as the Irl . « h-C \ . erticn Bii . sadtheDxt Ta ^ en- inore ocicu * tkan ai . vramsuiv ¦ wfe ^ ch ba-:- Lteen pa ^ .- ^ a ^ rce tbe No trau coLqse .- 'i —3 » slKctsi to ; ' ¦? Nei Poor Lawiiul . He-woui , ^ at say & word w ui- r ^ p : cl to th- > . ! tmicipal Rtfon-— -it La . a-eatiy ci * a- p .-inted b : ra . Tbe - eople were tlissansfirc . r > nd he kLe-sr r . o remedv bnc fcr : hr-r Tffcim— I ' . ' -ar , he ^ rj—hi . < rrored ccxviciion wa » thai there was to sa ! e > y for tbe p .-oplo , no s-crri-y iur mther tbe Lor j ? or tbe Crrwr . tsless t ^ ere wa > ««> e pr ,-gr ?» ive refcrtn . The town of Birring . bam l > t-ffn ; le cgitanoB : n lt 2 P . hot in 1-32 thrj e ^ rsw '« . ira-ion . ~ A'eMbe p ^ a-ins of the Ke fcri B 31 that lar ^ e zo ^ m sect to r .-s : ako » u infaiit on thp ^ feea- « t— ( : 2 ' : Ebt r )—tbev waited un : il tLree *^ s- ; ioH 5
of the RrfvrEei Parli . iraeni bad p 2 ^ i > _ -d -wiiho-t -tkere beir ^ the slightest bop ? of any aau liora-. ion in the cct ' : d-: n of the pev-j .- !^ . Th ' -y v- ? . i ; ed tLti . 1837 . L " . wb : ch y- cr E-aiiT uienl .- * waiu-d tspon h ' n ; "to take the leil m procaricg refcrm . In tbafVear » S parties— -Wliig- -, Torie * . ace Radicals—ram-to tm and >^ id , thai £ > Lord Mt-lbcurr-e ' s ^ Vdniitis l » Uni had com' ? in . it vas betier to wait and te ^ what he would do . He snew nothing oi Lord ilel-Imcfb ** , hiit trnrtiiig ! o h :. « manly charactrr , thev J ^ » S e ^ Sj ^ d all i ° ;! ihcc- v ' r . ' nsly tL ^ v r . bandonro Jt , and i p tbeme ? . E' ; iiie do ! - *< : b " an three tieputiliocs waited iTj ) on thv NoKe Lord , dtmandicg tlm ihepeopL- she-aid hzvc ziie mean * of Jivicg cpon tbe fruits of rbrir Jabcnr . Tiif-y vr ^ -e toli tnstih- > ttp
¦ rf _ Bimiipbtni wt-ra r . o : EuglaLd ; but they ¦ add r ~ -y would prove the rr . en of Birmir : £ bari were Ecgland . He ( Mr . Artwoud ) cared not how c-r ^ ry- * ha m-a- « u : r * tbe pei-j ,: e wcre rclirvcd . pro--ndsd th y—ere relieved . He wcu ^ d feel as gTRi-fr . i <«« tb ' -m re ' . ie-TT'i by the measures cf lb-eJiigbt "HcnoursbleBarcEet tbe member for Tamworth . or -fl » ft Noble Lord , as kt > wcu'd by ineairnres » f Ms ova gtfgesfiDn . Thpy pointed * " out to L-ord Melbrnrc ? aidihe Cnncrilor ot the Exchpque--. themean ^ bj which they m ch : gi \ e pro ^ perur to thecouLtry under tbe pr--ei : t coE ? ti : uticn without ¦ farther change . Lord Meibonrre had reminded him Aathehadjrtquentlv brought the subject of tte Tension ct the standi-d ot value \ inder t !_ e attention
of the House of CoEmon ? . btit that the Hoa » e had r i »* Ti an unwiliurcefts to attend to i ; . He then stated to Lord i ! elbc » HTOe tbey would endeavour lo cfcauge tii ^ Koc ^ e of = Con 3 rzson * ; and « o in tbe -winter ol 1 S 3 J . h ? went heme 10 hU honest - ri ^ nds acd told lira the rtin ' : t of tbat kst tffs .-t to iaskr fte » ndeiit c ? : ist : rction of tbe ccnutry ^ e « hdter and protection to che country . He toid tb m ¦ not toend-aTcur to tench tbe ancient framework ¦ f ¦ fl » cssstit&ricm—not to tcu ; h tbe great principle -of theCro << Ti . Lords . and Commons , and he doubted a » tbut tbat tbr-y wo-. l-i t ; : iina : e ' , y obtn ^ n tbat jn > - tice Jtnn prorection wbicbhad been denied them by tte Gorernr er , t . Tbat wsp the engine of thi * prea : petiiiDE . Hi « friend-- in the winter of J ? vJ 7 . cr-. w ^ er !
around him again as th-y had done in " 1829 . He lad Mid to tWm that h . < knew they had virtu-, inteEfct , and tnowl'd « e , bnt that he did not know file people of EngHnd were with them , end that be "would go to another part and see if otf . er men ¦ fiioQg rht with them , asd were dexeraiined- to act in the £ 82 & * spirit . Accordiag ' . y lie went to Glasgow fortkepnrpo «? of tryicK tbf leah ' cgs of the men of ficotlarid , aedthat -was tke rirst political eketiDg be iad en ? r attended cnt of Birmingham . When hs saw the miseries of the people of Glasgow , h .-said , * we have now proof we are not alone ;—we have a tight to interfere , and w « h 3 Te a right by every legal "means to demand from the Commons of England aUthe right * and liberties tbeir forefathers had . If
they succeeded , and he hoped they wonld , th ^ y szn ^ kt commit error * . But after watckiog this state of die country with m- ^ e attention acd more labour "fern most Honourable Members had given to the BHbjer * , he believed that there were no dangers and no miserie * that the people cf England ought sot to Bndnre in preference to submitting to the ctnel and ¦ Hsmderous operation "wfekh had preyed for twenty ¦ yearstogether , on tbe indnstry and honour , and security of the cocntrr . All he claimed was the ijght of living by hard" labonr . The . l .-2 C 0 , OOO pereqos -whem he now represented said they htd a nght tolivebyhnnest labour—that tbe fluctuation which fiAdtateE place had given tbem short sea » ens oLd" > i ; btfal prosperity andlon £ fea « on « of real adversitv . T , fv
Mid that , gerking acd irqyiring into the causes oi « e Eancnal misery , they could fkd no cause in Bstare cr Providence—they said that the Almighty - ™ wbeen _ kiEd and beneficent to England above all f * ? nations of the eirth—that he had given it a * « tE « people- the most intellectual and talented people on the earth—that he lai uUen it a fine soii adfood climate , and every bleB » ing of ri > ers and fcarbesrs ; and yet they said th-y eadured everv » wery ater twenty-two year * of profound peace ' : £ Sl , T ¥ ? ' - & ? Ked ^ li- ^ t of l » ing by their iabenr . The peuacn wasHned br J . 200 T 000 mm gere imshi be som ^ jgi ^ n , bat ' ' believed ' . JW ^ oded an fcjjltckld the subject , tbat one xnS ^ ot m . in W . R ^ ed-t ^ eirnamA- . with their fTlv fo W P ct - ^; inerefore , tbev . > oi wi tbe
, CTpanie » f ^ tney wrre elite of the wck . ra ^ tK ^ ia -and thie . ve > , R , ra ^ cy were apt to call than » ho atb-nrpred -o a . vr ; h , ! wil if [ keT were , ad their conplamu wn .- unfounded , it " would Aew thedreadJd * ta : e ia wbicu England wa ? p ' a ^ d " ¦* fB a i"il ; on or am . who could write th-ir own * sams , coua be got to pat tbeir hat ^ ds to a Eo toj wrns ^ -e . h these siea c-rld . b-.- taught to believe ± & * ithey were miserable * beu they were hapov ttf j » on . d have amvei a ::-. m ^ r dL « a > . rotL * state t ' ttangK . ^ He trnsu-d tL ? .: tbe Hou * e would BO ; tteattbis peti ^ on as the petition o ; workmen , bec » usia Dfiifved ike whole of tbe iciddle cla *> ei w-re
with them . In alinding to the middle clas ? e * . h ^ did J » t re ^ T to men with kic& : 1 iortuces , and ? mal ! ftmdfcoldcr ? , or those who had retired from t : a . ietut he meant the productive classes , the me : ch&r . t * ' * 3 k 1 rar-r ? , £ Jid the mamrac lure r * . II- was p . rfecdy cticviiiced tbat the petition * pci ^ tbe Jeehrgj ; < rf nine cu : of ten psrsvn * oi this ce » e : i ;; ricn . ThL Sax * , ccold not be cL * prored , thac i : o pc » i : ive " disire << siik trade or agriculture fver rescbed the laboir- - 5 ag iraAer or aei'cTilrTirist that did rot reach tteir emploj- r . I " , &ere : civ , he shewed tbat 1 , £ 00 . 000 of labo ^ ifrs r ere dL > lrc > seJ , might i : not with " equal trathtesaid their employ rs w . re r qnally so . Theft vssso desbt someproper tj bit ia England , bo " t gpne «
Untitled Article
- ' . " . f » Kii . ' ^ , . in- Ule . cuaii : - u .. ' lut ; lu ^ ki , ., t , u ! ir * ere as ducouteutrd as il : e vo kmen were . The m ^ - ciiauu lnceed , care n&X cou e >? li ^ Bi'TjaiioD . So i : ip ai « the merchant bad tis last £ 10 . 000 . pr id . made him hold ; yVb it vas gone , despair rcsci -.. imbrlu ; snd hence it was all boa * ting and delu-~ . oe , all prosperon- ^ ard h ? p > y outside , but wilhii -icha ? reRci 5 j -ec- :-: e . Hixiety , mi > ery , end des-- R ! j" . J ^' ^ " - " " ^ reanufneturm cf Eng-; . ^ Ed , if this qr , , Ton were put to tlum , wruld an ¦ wer riehtly . " Vf hy . we don ' t ccmplsin . men withut capital certair-jy are in bad condition , bt . t tner nth capital cf n do pretty well—^ refi t * ie eot as '^ rge , wwe could > TiAi , but still wo can go tsi . " But let the hru e Ttflfctoii this czte . Six inorfth * igo a bank at Liv- rocol totaled i 1 * p ffRir > . andhar 5 ' - " ' ^ ~ . ^ 1 * ii- 'ii « illf Til f * i . " L * Aij : - li i i lltt-4 Nii ; . i . . « - ¦ r . »
en its becks two bad debts of £ SCO . COO . Now , i ! 'ho * e two houses had ' b ^ ca asVec . Hiore this dfsclo- ¦ = ure , they dnred not fcave crmplaine ^—tl . ey dfiTec not have raid tr * t * e . wan bnc—for if lhey had ftey wonld have bees . tAed , ** Where , thtn , dV ? all this ncrmoes wealth -a are frrm—these imm « nsefecK > - rie>—these new hcuses t" and if the truth had'been d-dared , thf ^ y won ] d hare been ruined iirst&Eter . How little , then , eocld profesaioBsof m ^ rcbanteand raaBufccmrens he depended upon—who ^ e distress « ajt really as great as their workmen ' s ? He ( Mr . T . Attwc * d ) bad'be « i bred cp in scenes 8 o-cftl * jniious ; beooe be l ? a ^ directed Lis atttnticn to the suVject , and be didu « t scrnple to assert , as'ho had before staled , that fee masters suffered snre than their men . OHearJ There was a ereat-deal snid
abont the profit-iBangf is crinkir-ff tbe bleod of laboar-iEOE ^ er . ' , but be sfSrmed that every jnerchant rind mBatifactnrer-stffcred more than thexaen from ttis state -of things . Let the house only rrtlect on ihs nature of f-niecufscory . It had been stated over Bivd or r in th .-- public press , that thtnr manufactorsd goods bed row reacht-d the lowest-2 e \ -el , and that hoc a nano ' sctuier in tbe country woeld be f . ond to be soivvik . if ho were sold rr , u WTien a maruffictcrer had from £ 20 . 000 to , £ 30 . 00 C emplsyed in Lis -bD > ir ? ess , « -d derived lo pr « . rit Gtrh g an ' intervai of tvro rr ^ tbree year *; if be had tried to es-« -. pe he . wosld bemint-d by eni ' eKvrarinp ir > cell in his capita ]—if he » tc-od t-ti !; , he w * s ismfd—if hfp . dvaooed . he w&s ruior d—if he attempted to recede , be was ruined . . ( H ^ ar . ) Let it bo boja ? in mind
that tho nu ) ment they rV > tri-y « H the rr . arjufp . cturer '» profit , they anniliiiared eI-o h . < capital . The petitioners sought a remedy ior this ttnte of things , arid in t ' . eirconviction that reaseiiy wccld be found enly ia Universal Saffrace . They onVy songbt in rbi ? i ; - - ; - " c : to returii !¦*_ : « rr , c > n > j-r- ;; 'p . it ¦ rathe practice of ouranc « to' -y , establish rt-w ? ty Khonty atwr the Norman cocque ?! , an" 1 he b-. lieved that it had worked we ; l . B _ v r < tnn . i g to Thus salutary practice , they believed that the interes t s of the working class-.-e would be la-. ily attended to , while the aristocracy rnd tie crown wocld both fee strengthened . They next defended Annual Parliaments , in accordance wit ' u ibt- principles of the Act of Sftilecieiit , ; and as t at great oonstkutioKal act granted alro to ih- > pe ( ple oi £ Dj . li > rd irre ^ cru 1
of election , they-believe . t > . ^ t when theConstitction grnntrd a right , they s ^ pposer ! f ? i t e pepple shODld a ' so po ? sf .-s the rc-.-ans of f s ^ r .-i > rjg it , acd theref 'TPtb y i ' -, i . ri . f ] ¦ - ' ' Y « :-- } , y Ha . lot as a cocgriu-tional right . They uii ! :-. r i j ^ rd ¦!•? - r % l •¦ t p-iyir . g iLPcbpri o ! P ^ riiriiTc-nt . which « rj rIso j return to the aucin : i . r . ; c : ce . Th' y thought that tbr Cottrcons o ! fci .-flanu or ^ bt to be tbe Common * o ! EDtlai .-: —( n hcKhj—that t ) nt lio ^ s- ivght tj be u Ho-. se cf Lt-i- J--r . •* on ihe i ue « i : 3 e niid b s Lords en tbe o'bs » r—( r-icwrj ] iithur)—a House of f reiitlemen posse .-rii-g large prop- 7 ; ie > , t » hom glt get throng- , some portion n' ih- i . hMic brsmesi of the cuutry wc-: l > i )' Uth . but when they came to le ; isir--e U-r tbe indur : r ; or . s c ! : r :-i-s i ' i . i not tviEce
t-. e sligbte > t > y > parly fcr thrin . The p lidcners stited tbit the H-ju .-e of Chwiloes , as at present < -on . « utut-d . ccu j n t pcs > ib : y cmyriheud ihi ' wsnts o ! tbe working c ' a ^ .-e ; ' ; thry ihenght thut -v > . Ives ccrud not rrpn .-eEt shr ep , ht * did di . i ta-eu to t _ se any low i ij . rei = » i ( n ; tbst h :-. wks could n < : t represent p g ? tn » . tur rich TLen re ^^ e ^ eIlt tbe fe > - ! - i ' - -s and * aji ^ ot the peer . Th- j-f-tuicctre nrxt * sprefsed the r desire tha- tben > » hoold b-3 no Property Qaa : fi : ar . on . They did no' imegiue that any gentlt-mnu sbonM say , b-canse he happiued to be in the recopt o ! £ 3 uu " a yr ^ r , tbn : be \» as therefore mere entiiled t . b ccnji' a yop ^ iar representat ive thp . B a ze . < mbtr of U . e working c ! -sen . The m ; n wih i . 3 iK ) a rear miibt live in Caradsin
, K ; tm ; cbiirka , c in S . •• i'z-r ! .: n 1 —( laughter)—*^ bile it Was bis fi'm beii ^ ve ibat ' . he hoiie « t tradp ^ Klan , wLo _ earned his own bivai and tb ? it of his children bybi * Inbonr , hssd a greater stak p in the conntry tbsn TbeDukp « f No-thnrjbcrlant ! . They demandefl L r-ivei > al Suffrage ior tnclber nason . ' which wa « . that the £ 10 snflrHce had proved a total failure . Hon . zaembers would at-. r . ? e 'hem of resorting to physical fcic ^; but he (>' r . Attwcod ) had nsver :: dvi » fd anyih ) E < cf tli-.- ki n ' ' i ; le baa always set his iace Bg-unst violence , » nd a ivi-ed the ]> eople to act
as becanio a great ration— firmly ; u . d d- cidecly , but ¦ without vielaiiDg tbe lair . ( ilVar , hear . ) lie deplored that violk-cce La-i bet-n r sorted to ; and six mo :. tL- < since , in B : rr . infh ? . m , be had as-sured the people , that if ikeir blackest enemies sought to dev . sj the most eff-ctual mems of injunug the popular ciq * -, they coald adopt iiy b . tt ^ r means than ^ hat of strmir . g them . Tfe- r ^ were , however , ¦ 20 000 , 000 of in-n iu ibis country wtim nothing short of son , e gnat cou .-. l ' , tut '; onai change— . « om-1-irge and g-urrou * ra juareoiiib : ny—wonld 8 atb . lv . Tbe peop e of Et ^ li ^ d wi-ul i no ; c ntiuue to
submit to tse ii-. iai , g state of thirgs ; ? ir : d that no army could ceres tb- ? m into subin ' . s-iou . After aliu-ing to t e cai . ? p < which Jed to the French Rerolution . the Honourable Men _ ixrr ntrea . i ^ -s tt ? HoB 5 ( . to prufit by the lesson of < x-. eriruce . ( Hear , hi ar . ) T ^ e Crown of EcglaL-d—long m- ' ght it be held by it » pr ^ ent wearer—was , hko all other crowns , supjecu-il to the infl-. ^ nce of pibhc o > inion . With Buik ? , be wou ' . J « uy . that when tLe desire of cbanje becume universal , ihe change itsell became inevitable . " ] fthe q-estion came to amoral or pby « ctl- ^ sae , tbe rnicd ' . e ciiisses would one and all fall into tne rarik ? of 'he * or '; ing classes ; ¦ when discord aud a :-: a : c " riy -R ^ ere ytiwkiBg abroad , avt } Q if tbe middle cia ^ w s were uu ^ liiD ^ to take with tbe lo
part ~ cr or- ^ r .-, Jire o ^ ce .-sity would compel them to do so . lie believed ih-. t tbe people possessed the meai : s of reruedjing their gr ievances without t * ki = g anj illegal proce diegs . Wkea poli-if-ai unions were fir » t form d in this country . he had sent a case to a very eminent counsel for the purport of having his op : nioa i . s to the legality ol rhx * i - sotirdes . The able man wh'm he hud con-Niited returned the case , with an intimaticn that if he esH pohtical unions were illegal , he would be ssyiig what he dii not think ; an j if he gave hi * oj . in : oa that they were legal , he feared he might lead many honest men ss ' rfly . for it would be difncnlt , if not morally impossible , to join those asseciationa without trenchirg upon the la-r . He , therereturned the feeand f ? sed
fore , , * xprp no opinion npon the ratgect . ( Hear , hea-. ) Thi 3 was the way in which Mr . Charlss \ Vt : h . reli ( as we understood ) acred npon that cccarlon . He (> lr . Attw . od ) bad profited by the opinion which he had thus obtained without a fee , and had avoided the danger of OTerstepping the Jhmnutntia liicenia of the law . But couid the House suppose , that the same forbearance would be shown by men r . ble and willing to work , who had wives an > JamilifS of tea childreu , and who found theimelves borne down by scarcity of food and jcarcity of mc ; ney , whose wages were scanty , and whose loaf wjts mall , before whose eyes the pre 8 enl system placed delusive hopes to-day and ruin to-morrow ? Woald it be a matter of surprise
that m tbe breasts 01 sacb men mUery should torn at last to gall ? He had noT gone through the principal requisitions contained in the » titior , which he accordingly supported , and which he thocght ought to bo gr-. nted ; at seme period he was convinced they wO- ; ld be granted , and he only wished he was equally tare that , wlen granted , they would prodnee good re-alts . ( Hear , hear . ) He deprecated aay ot ; er then legal means of attaining this result ; he had never advocated any other , aad he should not be to blame if every attempt at recon - ciliation failed , and me ^' s minds became so excited aad determined aa te lead to events winch would be , not the violence of a mob , but a revolution . The Hon . Member cocdnded by moving tha resolution of which he had riven notice .
Mr . * 1 ELDE \* seconded the motion . The petition was an important one , sp-aking the opinions of an immeisu body of people , Ncrtb , West , South , and East , a . ad aereed to at an imrxense number of meetings held f .-r the purpose , aud he trngU » d it would obtain tbe serious consideration of the HoBBe . The petitioners allpgLd numer « ns gr iavances , and the question that presented itself was , Bfo these alltgauori * true ? The first which he ^ ''oi-U notice wa « , " ^ e are bo-wed doiro under a load of taxes : n aders on tke verge oi bankruptcy ; workecea > tar \ ir g . " No oue could deny the truiti of thi ? allegation . It was tU taxe . s the result of i :: iq' : itous wars , which bad caused the troubles com ^ l aiLed of arisiig out of ihe debt imposed to cany oa those war > , and wLich d-. bt ha-d been doubled in its pre ^ ur-e upon the peo ple , by actts pas . vedmthat House sii . ee the mar wss closed . itat
traders wer * on tbe verge cf bankruptcy no man can d ny ; that workmen were « tirving from wai . t of employment , end others for wa * t of remeceraticn fur the work they cid , wm , quttUy a notorious truth ; butii any one disputed it , he would jn > t mentio n cne fact to ^ haw tLat ili > must be so . U > ck at the hra ' e of the cotton-tra-Je , the gTeat mpaiii . actnre of th ? s country , and th « censemption 01 cott on dnnng ttisyear had been Ipsm than two-. h . ru * of- ^ hit it was in thf ye .-r prececiEg . Grea ' EwyiBjns altopKLerat a l . u . & . rnd mo toHbe * *? X ¦ ' T ES ' ^ 0 ' tLre- ' : pur dav , a-week ! -Ed thetce it must be odious to ertry one that the ssr ^ Vi ™ r&TSi ^^ P ^^^^ lb ^ e ^^ - - fcEudu . the Reform Act of 1 ^ 2 . Th ^ STbecn buterlv and b ^ y dec , iv , d . " U * too ( i F H teprdftfa redres , of thf nrieraucea 0 | the peop "
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TuLU lie WOlKiuj , Ol Uit > J' } lujlii lii ; i ; bul Ue hrf-K . wilh the petitioner . - "* that 1 le had been Hlterly vat basily deceived . But do rot lh « RcUoftbe Refenned House ju . 't ify tbe Allegation ? The first aci * n 8 a Coercion Bill for lxelnrd , gtiffrricg Ireland . j ? bith never can be » po >* n of a * a fit compariHOi . f orany people ; but commissioners have been » en ! ut to inquire into the state of that people , wbi eported there were 2 , 300 , 000 bejyrars , that there are . ") , U 00 , 000 of acres of land uncultivated , but -capable of yieldicg produce , that the ltnd in cultivation wor . ld yield one-third more thacitdce ? if the proper ^ atonr W 88 le * toved on it . But what c . o Ibe commissioners reeoitiiEend ? That > nine millioEs o ) iv .... .... ....... . . , ii ii . ^ . . ... ,. ^ ,... * ... > a * .--. *
a ? cney th&nld be voted cntof B » e v'lbl'C tsxee to transport these 2 . 3 G 0 . 0 OO beggars , whom they re ported te be people willing to wotk if work were invcnthem ! The next act was the renewal ot the Bank Charter , making Back of Ergland noter a If gal tender , which they cover were before a ^ any period , and hence had arisen what seme call prosperity , but if it was to it was of a transient character , for in 1836 it broke down , and the sufferings had been greater since Ann they were ever before . This was done to expand the currency , to
enable tbe Hou « e , by a sort of respite from distress , to introduce and carry out laws which it would have dared to do , if there had not been a temporary relief obtained by tampering with tbe currency . One of that cramp he would mention , your New Poor Law , which was passed the year following . This law , by iU operation , had done mere than nnj other that had anser , to prodece the agitation and the discontent that prevailed through every par t o ' the kingdom , and produced thy petition , which was now proposed to be brought under the consideration of the Hon (« e . Tnia law cannot be continued
11 was the introduction of a syetem of centralisation , intended to be carried out in all departments o ! Government , tbat they might have puppets and tyrants in every pariah in Englind , moved by stringp , the centre of which was at the Uotue-cffice . It was called " unconstitutional , " a " tjranny of the wor ? t description , " and rce that " the people of England would never submit to . " These were terms applied to it by ltarned persons , Members of th House . TLe promoters of the Reform Bill said their object was to carry out good Government . Had that befn obtained ? Was not the vt ry reverse the fact ? The fourders of the American Republic , some of the frx 3 at * st men of the age , had told us what good Government required to be done ; the
object wag , thty sail , " to protect life and limb , and ensure tbepurenitof happiness . " And one of their * rr at leaders ( Mr . Jeffmon ) had told us how this was to be dene , and he ( Mr . Fielden ) begged tic attention of liberal members to the words which he would B' -. w quote from the memoirs of that distinguished Ameru-3 » . They Wf-re exceedirgly p ? ri-HeBt , bea * . ti ! ullye . xpn-s <; d , very abort , andcontained the art of Government . " It is cot by tke consolidation or concentration of powers , bat by their distribution , that good Government is t ffected . Were not lias gr . st country already divided into s ' atcs , t . at division must be made , that each might do for itself what coLcerca itself directly , and what it can so much better do than a distant authority . Every state is divded into
, Egain , co-. ntitNJ , each totak ^ eve ol ¦ k Umc li-m within i ' s kral ronnd *; each county egain into townships or wares , : o maib > e minuter detai l * ; and every ward into farmis to be Ri . vern'd each by its inovidiial proprietor . " Tke beauti ul couc'usion , to shew the truth of what he had advanced , wa . s thes foreibly illustrated : — " Wenwe directed from Washirgton when to sow and when to leap , we should coon V 7 att bread . " ( Hear , hear , hear . ) That was good governors i « aw necessary to b * done ; trat i . * , to allow the people to gt . vern themselves under just lavs , the very reverse of wbat the Refonred Parlii-ment had done by couptitutirg ccmmisMocers . in ^ pector ^ , end such tyroDts , t- make rules ar . d retu ' atiens ,
outofParliairent , as bh ding as thr law * made by that House . ( Hear , hear , I ear . ) Another act that the Re ' onned ParliJjiient Ltd Cone was t >> vote twenty nnllien * far tbe tmandpaticn of the blr . ck slaves , to be paid by tbe white slave * of tui . s country , who Wtre worse treated then the black themselves , which had been pruvtjd o ^ er and over a :. ain to be true as regarded tbe hand-loom weavers . Th . se are a few of tbe bad aeU , and oiily a few , wLich this house had passed . But it had n-fu .-ed to puss m « ny acts which the people prayed for . It had reiu * d to tqualia . * the stamp-tax , which bis latehon . colleague Hiked th »« m to co , and which the pres > ct Cl snc ^ llor of the Exchequer had promised to do . It refused to repe « l the Septennial Act . It refueed to repeal the malt
lex , and mruiy other tnxes which press severely on the indofctrious poor . It had refused to aboli . « U ihe corn laws , and to adopt a property tax , the enly just mode of taxation . Lastly , it Lad retnsed to ft-peal the new poor law , which it nrust yet do , cr there never could be peace and contentment in t . is cc untij . All its proceedings had tended to uphold the fundholders and the owners of ve . » ted money interests , and it had neglected to do anything to protect the poor . His Hon . Friend , th" Member for Birmingham , had taken Hp a considerable portion of the lime cf the House in his statement , which made him fMr . I \ ieldtn ) rtJuclant to occupy so much time , fis he might well do upon this s bject ; but he could not sit down withe ut saying a few words as to
the rtmedy which he thought cught to be attempt d for the present ci . ite of the nation . The p < titiou- rs pray that every man of tweuty-one years of age , nncontaminated by crim a , should have a voice in chors . ing those who make the law * ; they prayed for Parliaments to be &nr . ually el cted , for voteo to be taken by Ballot , for Members to be paid for their * ervi « -ee , and for Property Qualifications to bo discon'intied . This the Houre he intreated to do . Ho would say , with the Petition , that they had a right to claim to be represented in this Hon « e . Blackstone says , in his Ccmmentarif s , that it is the law of the land , that no man shall be taxed without his consent , or the conseut of his representatives in Parliament , and it cannot bt » said that any man i ? represented unless he possesses a vote ta return
Members to that House . He , therefore , demanded for those petitioners a compliance with the prayer of their pe : ition » . He did it from a conviction that groat danger may be apprehended from a denial of their r ascnab ' e prayer ; but if the House shoHld decide not to do this , let them decide to get them a remedy in another way , and relieve thf ir sufferings by adopting an eqnitRble property tax , by repealing the toxe . i on malt , hops , salt , sngar . tea , and on all other articles which lorm a great part of the things consumed by tbe pocr , and by an abolition of the Corn Lavs . And , if that House ^ ho&ld refuse to do one or other of these thingn , he entert < uned very serious apprehensions that they would have to regret having come to inch a determination .
Lord JOHN RUSSELL said that tbere was one part of the speech of the Hon . Member for Birmingham which he was extremely gratified , though not surprised , to hear . He olludrd to tkat part in which the Hon . Member denied any concurrence with thoGrt who recommended a resonrse to arms and physical force , aad in vhich he aad expressed his determination to di * conntecance any attempt to overawe- the Legisltture by an exhibition of physical force . He ( Lord John Rassoll ) was not surprised to hear the Hon . Member for Birmingham give expression to those sentiment * , for they were only is accordance with what the Hon . Member had said on varioms occasions , both » hen he addresjed that House and elsewhere . ( Hear , hear . ) At the same
time the Hon . Gentleman mut > t have been aware that theee who promoted the petition , which , as he believed , was , by an Hndua assumption , called the National Petition , had gone through the country from town to town , and from place to place , giving expression to tie most violent language to ltmgaage not exceeded in violence and atrocity at the worst period of th * French revolution . The House owed it to th ® good pecse of the people of this conntry that those baraDgaea had not been listen : d to . ( Cheira . ) Those attempts had be-n in vain made to indnce the people to assume a menacing attitude towards those who administered the law . The Hon . Gentleman who presented the petition had dwelt upon the political considerations
involved in the subject , and the social condition of the people . The political objects sought fcr were , as it appeared , Universal Suffrage , Annual Parliaments , Vote by Ballot , and tha absence of Property Qualification fcr Aiembers of Parliament . Tbe Hon . Member had almost exclusively confined himself in his speech to the fact * stated in tbe petition in support of the proposed choDge in the representation ni the country , and of the proposition to admit every man of fnll age to the right of a voice in the elect ion of Members of Parliament . He had , indeed , no doubt that so far the Hon . Member had spoken the sentiments of the greatest number of those who had signed tie petition , who , though they had taken ro part in the attempt to excite the people to take be
arms , yet lmagi ^ d that the conntry would made somewhat mcrr ^ puperoun , more wealthy , or more happy , by the adoption of Universal Suffrage . The Hon . Member wifhed for Universal Suffrage , be cause the Parliament could not give prosperity to day and adversity to-morrow . Ut ( Lord J . Rossell ) conceived there was no fbff £ of Government which could inture to a whole cQJjrfnunity a perpetual and lasting itate of prosperity ; that in a country , moreover , which depended very much npon comaierce Rnd manufactures , there was do mode of preventing that state of low wages or that distre * j which at all tices affected those who were at the bottom of the * cale in the commnnity nhich would
or prevent those alternate fluctuations irom prosperity to distress which occurred in every commoiiity . ^ Let thin \ look to that country which was sometimes held out , es a country erjoyirg , in politics or its social state , greater advantages than cur own—he meant the Utitt d States of America . Tiiere iLey bad generally Universal Suffrpge . But vfculd aiij- Ejjua say that the United State * was altogether frte from those fluctuations ?—( Sear )—they enj-ying , as they did enjoy , an advtmtnge which we ccuid n « t— that they had immense tracts of fertile ¦ and , upon which their population , which could not - " . ; tmst in town ? , nvgfct always fkd r . fuge— an ad . vantage whiofc we did not pogiesg—^ Uear , hear , ) ' -
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cajid aay man say tl . at in tho United Staies > , ! Aineiicb they were free from thoeetvuar ( Hear ) Not / With respect to ttose views of the Right Hon . Genneinan , which would give an increased quantity of money and a large paper credit . There had be « i published in America , as a sort of manual for the people , a pamphlet , called the " Detection of Forged Men y , " which showed there were not less rhau 6 C 0 kmds of forged money ia circulation . Conld there be a greattr evil Uian Laving a currency of this kinc , by which the poor were exposed t » have their whole means taken from them by means of s » ich fcrged money , end that forged money being perhaps a consequence of some over speculation end hb attt-mpt to rf Jit-ve the distress of the community . Therefore it w&h not by Universal Suffrage , nor by a » y form of suffrage , that lawg could be obtained f > . \ " ! ill fl . ^ V TllM VlMv < vrt . nr « s . * iv ^ . f 1 >^ 4 A . ^ lL 2 > . *
which should 8 enrd this lasting prosperity to the people . Now wuh respect to the petition itself . He wished to make a few observations with respect to it , aud wilh respect to the conduct of those who had been active in promoring it . ( Hear , hear . ) The honourable m « mbur had said there' were more than J , GOO , 000 of signatures . He ( Lord J . Russell ) was not surprised that 1 , 000 , 000 signatures should have feeen collected , considering the industry which had been niani ' ested in their collection . At one time he believed that Major Cartwright obtained no leKB than . 8 ) 000 . 000 of signatures to petitions asking for Universal Suffrage . But as to this number of 1 , 000 , 000 . When they spoke of the representation , acd said there wero 1 , 000 , 000 of persons having the
nght of vohDg , they wero told that was a very small , and insufficient , and contracted number , who were entitled to the choice of representatives . But . yet , when there were a million of signatures collected by this nu'&hs , they were asked to consider this as the petition of the whole peopla at large , nnd it was even called on the motion " The National Petitioii . " He denied that the petition r ^ preeeuted the 8 ? ntii ? -ent * and opinions of the people at large . He believed the great majority ot the people did not ask for the objects contained in the petition . Hu belief whs , that the great majority of the people , divided ae thry were ia politic *! opinion , did not think that advantage would result to them from the adoption of tliese mcatiures , and that they would be alarmed at the
prospect of the petition bang granted ; aud the . Honse agreeing vtith the Hon . Gentleman to ^ o iuto committee with the view of establishing by enactment the object of this petition , would creata alarm and dismay thru ,: oat the country—aot merely among persons of property or the aristocracy , but more so among the labouring classfs than a . y ether portion ef tlm community . ( Hear , hear . ) He now brgged to call the attention of the House fcr a few moments to tha statement of fact made in the petition—a statement which tha Hon . Member for Birmingham seem d disposed to trust te . The P'titianers staced themselves to bo bo * od do * n und r st load of tnxes , which , notwithstanding , fell f ^ r : : ¦ . lv > h- re of the wants of their rulers ; that
ca -raLbruUKiit no profit , and labour no remunerati ! - »! ; that l ; i ivt-. r-hou- > -s of the pawnbrokers were filli , n d t ' u » workhouse was crovdH . and" the nriLiTiicTi - rr < W ; t . d . Now , he ( Lord J . ll ^ ell , entirely ( ie :: i- \ i t ' iii : that waHcorrect . Aud h-- would appeal to tlu-.- < ; i ' .:. ent mado by his Ilieht Hon . Fri-nd ihe olnt-r liAll with resj > t-ct to tl » , Stiviug *' banks oi ihe country , which in the last year showed a balance over r . e preceding one of more thau a million in favour of the sums vested . Now , was such i fact compatible w . th the st-. tement that thi ; war < - - Lou-es of the p iwiibrokePs wert ) nt present lull ? ( Hear , hear . ) U ' as it not a proof that there were a number of artificers and labourers who were not only receiving cnpital wages , but who were at the
same time looking forward to the support of their fmniiie . " , and the increase of their small capital , and who were from year to year increask . g those sums by the exertions of tlieir industry , and by submiitinK to privations of any thing wkich would prevent them from making t '<> esu accumulations . Instauci's were quoted in th ? early part of the session of the Savings' Bank of Glasgow , a manufacturing to -n . He ( Lurd J . Ru-si-U ) had seen aa accuut o ! thf Savings' B : uix of Duvoas' . iire . an ngriculturnl co'inty ; aud bath these nccjunts showed a v-ry grjat advance in the amount of inocey deposited , and were completely decisive as to the want ofpixoi of ihe description given in the petition . Considering this p -tition to ba a very gross exaggeration of state of tho
th country , and of any distress which might prevail in the couutry , ho was not about to deny that in a country like thin , depending sj muc ; -. upon commerce , upon credit , i pjn mauufactun' . .-, aud upoi various other circumstances , thert : was at thin time , as he was tifrnid there al -rays w . mld be at tinns , numbers of industrious *\ nd s > ber working men whus means were exceedingly scanty , and whose situation c-. uld rot bo looked at without pain and commiseration . Buc he denied that this was a fair represenution of the state ot the people , and he thought they ought rather to look at the other ratasures which the House was asked froy . j time to time to adopt for the relief of distress . The Honourable Member for Birmingham , and the
Himonm-r te Member forOldham , who had seconded the motion , eccmed to suppose , as they always cid , that the House w < n bound to listen to their own particular remedies , and that if they were not listened to thip-oplo werj aggrieved . ( Hear . ) He did not deny that the Honourable Members might thiuk these measures for the good of tha people ; but he id deiij tl . at , because , they did not at once concede to thi ir opinions without considering whether thev were sound or not , that they , therefore , refused that which was just and would be beneficial . ( Hear . ) The Honourable Member for Birmingham had always held tliat the one measure which would give prosperity to the country was nn alteration in the stundarl of valu ^ , and a very groat increase in
the quantity of paper money ; and the Hon . Member held that opinior , having Keen beford th . it year from which he said our misfortunes c > m men ceil twentytwo yenm ago , and having seen prosperity prevail fvT some years , when there was a great tfll- ; x ol paper money in the country , he held it to certain degree as justified by the experience of these years . Did the Honourable Member believe that all t ^ ose who advocated Universal Suffrage would agree vfith him in that opinion—that they would agreo to that change in the standard—to that immense quantity cf paper money ijsuing from the banks ? l ' . ' . is , p -rriaps , might enable the peoplo to receive 30 . ' . iasiyad of los . for wages , but in the same proportion would they have to pay for every loat and
every article which they consumed . ( Hear , hear . ) He would read to the Houso the opinion of some Hon . Gentlemen who were members of what was called thj "General Convention . " They spoke of the power and the corrupt influei-. ee ot' piper money" —^ henr , hear , )—of the " corrnpt system-of banking "—of tha ' ? fraudulent bits of paper wLich thn state , has dignified with the name of money "that " through its instrumentality our rulers had warred with freedom both at home and abroad ; '' and that it had " generated a species of dishonesty unknown to our forefathers . " ( Hear . ) He might employ some minutes in endeavouring to show the lloase that the Honourable Gentleman ' s opinions of the value of paper money were totally unfounded
—that the i « ue of this quantity of paper money , while it committed a fraud apon every creditor in thu country , would , in fact , be one of the means by which the labourers themselves would ba defrauded . ( Hear , hear . ) But he need not enter into any argument « f that sort , because those who had signed for Universal Suffrage were much more strongly opposed with respect to that to which the Hon . Member for Birmingham tcek as the care for all our eviis . He asked the Honse , therefore , not to agree to the proposal of the Hon . Member . The Hon . Member , and those who went with him , who fancied that Universal Suffrage would place tbe labouring classes in a s : ate of prosperity , were labouring under a complete delusion . 1 here were only two whys in
which the position of the labouring classes would be improved . The one would be by au increa . se in their wH ^ es , in their real wage ? , by a higher reward for their labour . Now , did Universal Suffrage tend to any thing of that kind ? Would the enactment of Universal Suffrage promote that object f If the country remained in a state of tranquillity , he did not think it Would lave any effect one way or the other . But if n change in our institutions drove away many of the employers of labour—if it drove capital cut of the country , or induced many proprietors no longer to employ labourers in this country , it would be increasing the number of labourers and decreasing the stock for the employment ol labour , and wouW , therefore , be diminishing wagf s . ( Hear . ) The other mode
by which many had held oui that the condition of the labouring classes could be improved , was b y a general distribution of all the property of the rich amongst the poor and labouring classes . Upon that he need not argue . But that » as the way in which , some had been induced to sign the patitioi : —it was the manner in which many reckless demagogues had sought to produce an effect throughout tUe country , holding out that all property was to be divided amongst the people in general . He wa * sure that every Member of tbe House , and the great majority of the people , were aware that any scheice of that kind would tend not only to the destruction of our institutions—to the destruction of every thing which made this country valu-« ble , but tLat it would , before any long time , be the source of ruiu to the labouring classes themselves . knew
( Hear . ) He not how , in any other way that cotld be proposed , the adoption of a plan of this kind woula tend to rawe their means and increase thf ir riches . His belief was , that , generally speaking , the institutions of this country tended to give to tbe people as great a portion of freedom and security as had ev < : r been secured by any institutions to the people of any connlry . He knew no instance of any people existing on t ' . e face of the globe , which did enjoy the .-e adv&nwges to a greater extent , lhiru was gT « at political liberty in some conntries the stcurity of the person , the genera ! suprt-nncy ol the lav ' , were less strong and lees fortified in those countries than in our own . ( Hear , hear , hear . ) In other countries ths > re was a greater ¦ military force to repress t . ny thing Hko disturbance- ( hear ) -in those cone meg there was far less of tbat freedom to which
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be had acvertrd . So that upon the whole he knew tot that , by * ny great cl ange of oor institutions * uch as the Hon . Gear , nun had proposed , he could at all advance or pr mote the welfare of th > people of this country , lie supposel that the Hon . Gentleman world ha-iy contend , after the adoption of Universal Suffra e and Ann j * 1 ParKanv'Et-j , that the rest of our institutions wbu'd remain in Ihflir present state . He coi : ld nit Mtpj ose that the monarchy , that our hereditary Leguiir . ture , aad our various institutions , wjuld remain as they now were ; that they would not ba changed for other restitutions , if so large anl demcciaical a change should be . adopted . He did KOt believe that any such change , ev «» n if it could possibly be accomplished three days hencewould tt nd to the comfort l _» i . . * * - ¦ . _
, and prosperity of any portion of the people ; he did not behove that it would tr-nd to the welfare of the majority of those who had signed the petition . ( Hear , hear . ) He conld not conclude without adverting to the near s by which those who professed to bo member * of the General Convention professed to carry their object into effect . They stated that at the unanimous request of the Convention they urged the people to agree to the following termsthat they should individually an \ collectively withdraw thuir money from the savings' banks—that they should convert all their paper money into goldthat they should abrtain from the use * of excis- < able liquors—that they should commence » n exclusive system of dealing—and that they ghoul ! exerciss
tkeir ancient and constitutional right of providing themselves with arms . These were the modes which they propose for the purpose of insuring success . ( Hear , hear . ) Sjme of those who had impelled the Chartists may have act ^ d conscientiously ; but there was no doubt that a great part of th » . m wero delndiug the credulity of the rest . He was certain that the objects which they avowed ought to be opposed with det . rminoiion , because if they were achieved tSey would be fatal to tho constitution of this country , fatal to those rights which were now com plained of as a monopoly , arid fntal to our-system of established govrtrnmnt . H *( LorJJokn Rusaell ) would not say toat those consequences he deprecated would take place . On the contrary , he believed that t
'ne delutlers ot the people would b j foiled by their own tff . irts . He believed that fie greut majority of the wcrkmg closes now saw as he did , that tta adoption of the propositions in the petition would he moat injurious to thsmselves . He believed they now 'pnrned the intended advice they received —( cht > rs i — aid that they wen ; mow beginning thoroughly to see through " the m-rives of t ^ ose dewiping pt rsons who hud been attempting to delude th * m merely for the purpose of set-king out a private income at the expecse of their dupes , tie had no doubt tLat thos 9 cra ' . ty persons would speedily Had their trade at an end , and that ihe good svnse and virtue of the people of England would be fjital to their schemes and objects .
Mr . D'ISRAELI concurred in a great deal of what had b-. -en said by the Noble Loni . In all lar ^ e populous countries there was ever n Wvea of . discontent . There wns snch a 1 ; aven in this country , :-. nd that leav . n was the basis of the present movemert . ( Hf >» r . ) He ( Mr . D'l . ) Hid certainly think th : u thi ' civ , ] rp-lrr . of 'he pe-pie of England lm ul . » ir t a .-ctibo the Charter to the . New Poor Law , though he behevpd it had some connexion with tbat measure ; but he beli .-ved also that the consciences of tlu presiMit state of feeling amongst thosn clashes would be soon most Eeriour * ly felt . The New Poor Law had b < en pas .-: e . l ou tbt ; principle of outraging those civil rights which had « o long b ^ en the cause of the robustness of our Commonwealth , —( laughter , )—lor tod the
n . poor , tliit instead of appljicg a « hitherto to their neighbours for relief , they must drpr-rid upon a distant Government . The . Noble Lord had answered the Houournbl M- mbers for liirmiLgham , but n ^ t the Charti ? t > . The Noble Lord seemed to show great cm ; fi . le . net * in tho tempt-r nnd virtue of the people of the country , great ioufUe-nco in hims- > lf , nnd great confi . ieact-iu l . is < Jo veranu-nt . ( Hear and laugher , ) But this did cot warrant liis contumelious and I . is captious tone towards tho petitioners . The petitioners amounted to 1 , 280 , 000 discontented fellcw-jubj-cfs . Such a number t > ught at least to be treated with courte ^ v . He would maintain that which was called a cheap -ystem of cettnil government would be found incompatible with the civil rights of ihe people of England . ( Hear . )
Mr . HUM E would not follow the Hon . Gentlaman who spoke last through the whole of his argaui-nts , buths m-. Mt say , if his ( Mr . Heine ' s ) side , of the Househ old done but little towards relieving the distress which existed , the otKer si . ie had doue less . ( H-ar . ) He agreed with the Hon . Gentler * sn that there were srrong grounds for complaint . Complaints had taken a deep root , and were widely spreading . Organization win going forward , and th « great suft ' -riBg which immeroas class-.- * experienced was initselt a suiriciimt ground for calling lor n Reform in that House . After the passing of tho Reform liil ! , the pt-ople wire led to expect better results than had taken place ; they had pitiei-tiv suilered f . r yearc , and they were forced at Itngth to
Hy their coinpLiiuta before Parliament . ( Hear . ) In the prayer uf the National Potiti-m there was nothing tingular , nothing novel . Tho petitioners did not ask Jorapapercurrency . ( flear , hear , and a ltnss ; h . ) They did not say that a paper currency would provide ch ^ ap bread , aud although it was alleged by Hon . Members opposite , that they were sufforiug under theoperatiou of the New Poor Laws , that law wds not namt-d in the petition . ( Hoar . ) T . . Noble Lord ( the Home Secretary ) in his opinion had not dealt f . iirly with the peuti vm ; he had not fairly described its prayer . What the petitioners risked for was , tbat the House would take the grievances into serious consideration , and grant a remedy by giving Vote by Ballot , Universal
Suifra ^ e , Annual Parliament , and provide for the I ' -ivraent of Members . ( Hear . ) They asked for a change of the c mstirution ; all they warned waaa change in that House , uud it could ^ not be denied , that they had string grouuds for wishing for some change . The poorer classes wt-re suffering much br cause food-was dear , and wages low , anC , thi refore , he though no one wonld attempt to say that such a state of things could continued without danger to the country . It was a subject whichha 1 nothing to do with the currency or with the Poer Laws , aad he trusted that the Chartists would b , e judged by the prayer of the petition . ( Hear , hear . ) The petitioners were 1 , 280 , 000 in number , and they approached tho House wilh a simple prayer , in answer
to which the Noble Lord asked it any man cotld expect that Universal Suffrage would produce cheap bread —( bear)—or if what they asked for would pro - duce any b .-nefit , or do any good . He ( Mr . Hume ) held m his hand a copy of the People ' s Charterlet it speak for itself . The House would bear in mind that the petitioners were not unknown—they were not individuals incapable of judging for themselves j aad therefore it was impossible to forget the great forbearance they had exercised in making their gnevaaces known , f H « ar . ) They had be .-n pa&ently waiting to see what Parliament Would do ; they found that no attempt was made to relieve them and therefore it was a fallacy in tb . 5 Nobia Lord to say that the petitioners did not know what thev
asked for ; and he ( Mr . Hume ) would venture to say that no man , who understood the British Constitution , could object to the principles of the People's Charter . ( Hear , hear . ) The principles of the Charter had , on many occasions , been , advocated by the most eminent men in that House . Tke Hon . Member here read the proposed Charter , providing Universal Suffrage , Annual Parliaments , Payment of M ember *? , < fec , and asked if there was any man in existence who would say that at the present moment ( he Honse of Commons reprejetted the opinions of the People of Eagland ? ( Hoar , hear . ) Hon . Gentlemen might cheer , but he repeated , no one could say that the House of Commons represented the opinions of the people of Ecglaud . ( Hear , hear . l i he unamsts
only demanded that the ancient Constuatian of England might be restored to them . I hey asked for nothing which had not been asked for before . What was the state of things at present . Ihe Houso of Commons was elected by one-sixth part of the people , and the basis of the Constitution ^ cording to the opinions » f Blackstone , SirTtomas White . IIampden , and other eminent authorities , was , that taxation and representation shonld go together , and consequently no man could be considered free , if he did not possess a voice ( through . h' » representative ) in pawing laws for the protection of \ $ * a ™ pr ? P"ty : j ( Hear , hear , aad loud cheers . ) 1 he Chartists said , and said truly , that as they did not participate in the election of representatives in the
House of Commons , that they were slaves . ( Hear , hear . ) They complained that the laws were passed for the benefit of the few , and not fcr the many ; and he defied any man to contradict that the laws of the country were partial—they did benetit the few to the injury of the many . The aristocracy were bone fited-the working classes were oppressed , and they were , therefore , warranted in demanding equal laws ( Hear , hear . ) It was said Universal bafirage would not give cheap bread ; but perhaps it might be the means ol repealing the Corn Laws , which made bread dear . ( Hear . ) There coHld be no equal taxation when laws were kept un for the benefit of the rich , and which madefoodUeaf &L ? * tl ™ ° not 80 W 6 b as in 1837 , yet bread and other articles
necessary of life were much dearer-Chew , hear ) -thereforc . tho Noblo Lord was decidedly wrong in the view he had takrn ot the question . ( Hear . ) Those who represented the aristocracy of the country had not a common teelini ? witlfetheir fellow-men ; from their situation in li'e they wera so far removed from all knowledge of the misery which existed , that they were nuwiOine to gram tho boon a , * ed for by the petitioners . The petitiinerg , however , were backed by the best of precedents , ft- could not say the Noble Lord ridiculed the petition , but . he said if its praver ww granted , it would not confer that boon which the' Petitioner * expected . Although tbe Noble Lord di&er ^ d in option witlvthe potitioter * & % T dany tfcingoff-nave . Hewasoloption that the Suffrage ought to bu extended to Wl males
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ot twenty-one years of age , of so «» d mfej aad not attainted wirl » cruxe . The den and of the CWtLtwas not new . tie found , in 1 ? S 9 > nd 1790 , neer mgs 01 men ia high trtatioas were 1 eld to advocate that principle ; depntksfrtm all th 3 coontiesin the Kmpdom assembled for the pnrpo * r , and sat in Ccn V ° ^ . * ? W ™ favcnr of »¦ "tension of tho Stiflrage , and therefore they oa * ht cot to quarrel with the name which the peti-ioxtt-rs adopted when they eel ed themselfes 8 cpporU > M of the National Convf nticn . It hjtd often b < en said tbat there was not much m a name , b « t Le theaght sometimes there was ; and he could not help tbinkin * that the delegates had assumed a foolish title . ( Hear , hear ) A convention was held in 1790 , wh : A passed
reso-JuuonB setting forth th « . necessity of Aortening the doranon of Parliaawnt ,., and > o far back ai the reign of Edward the Third , it wa . enacted thai a new Parhammt sh © old assemble every year or oftener , if nrce ? sary , ( Hear , and laaghter . ) The Stfi ^ ^ ™> ¦ AtTParBJiBitJ n , t S . AA CteA ¦ B »« 11 J » Md « H ™ . Gentlemen now attended more closely to boriiMsa , theyxnitht meet oltener than they did . The Dnkeo / S mcnd , » 1782 , introduced a bill into the Houieof Lord-vsivintfthe n « ht of voting to all male adults of eound mind , and to limit the duration of Parliaments to one year y he also nrop < wed to divide <" - * fi * L > " . exte ^ the franchiL L much m pot SSlf Z ' viw * . V 18 C 0 HDtTy into dUtrlcta ; W S /?) , A - Hnme ) «»« ended that the ' principle of the Charter was not new . He regretted SV ™ kJLVlt }??? « *» P «*« t-flanghteT } -b
: ., _ > cause he wished to allude to a aprech of the Hon * Baronet ' ainlSO ^ ( Hea r . ) In that year SL Hon * Baronet , in presenting a petition for the more equal representation of the people , contended that all votes ought to be taken in tecret , viz ., by Ballot—( hear)—and that Parliament ought to be bronchi back to its ancient duration , via . —one year . Thi * said tke Hon . Baronet , was the height of his ambition to accomplish , and lower he conld not descend Tory definition of Univeml Suffrage was desti notion of property and impracticable . The Chartist definition was , that if any man was refused hwjust andl' -gal rights m taking a partin tbe election ot tha representaUvesofthepeople , thatitamonntedtoasentecceof outlawry and robbery . ( Hear , hear . ) And that was the true definition , lor the party wan obliged to lea » ethe makine of law * affecting MU n ^ A
property in the hands of those in whom he could place no confidence . He was-at the m ^ rcy of those whom he looked on with dis'tust . ( Hear , hear . ) He had one more authority in support of the motion , and that was the opinions of the Noble Lord ( J Rush li ) and Earl Grey , at the time of introducing the Reform Bill . These Noble Lords on that occasion said , that by the ancient constitution of the country noman could bdlegnUy taxed in support of the state uclefshecor . sented to it himself , or through his representative , and therefore , after sach a declaration ot opinion , he di .-l not know how the NoWa
LorJ conld now turn round and laugh at tte idea ef Universal Suffrage . After gome ftrther observations , the Hon . Membor proceeded to say that Lord Gn > y believed the shortening of Pxrliawents was strictly in accordance with the constitution , and wou d cive general satisfaction . The Noble Lord a > ked on tke discussion of the motion for Household Suffrage , wpuld Honnehold Suffrage give cheap bread ? He did not say trpt it would ; but it would be a step to mo-e ext-nsivo scenes ol operation . ( Hear , hear . ) He begged pardon fcr tre .-passirig to long on the House ; but when a petition was prexen ted , signed by upwards of ene million of people ^ it was deserving of the greatest attention . The petitioners did t wih to interfere with
no > the Crown , or the aristocracj \ but they wished to keep the latter in the proper place ; end therefore he did pray the House to go into committee , and if all that the petition nsked lor could not be granted , part of it might . ( Hear , hear . ) Th ^ re would not be so much daagorin increasirg tbe constitneucy to ' our or five millions « * there wns by keeping them , out of that right . He therefore again repeated , tbat he trusted the Hou . « e would a ^ ree to the motion of his Hon . Friend the Member for Birmingham , by going into committee , and see what relief couldbe afforded for the misery which existed . Mr . SLA . N EYhad always been a supporter and ardent frieiil of reform , bat he could not consent to
going into committee on a petition which asked for such large , extensive , and in hi * -rpinion , such dangcyons chapges . ( He ¦ r . ) He Was aware that great distress existed , and he thought something might bs done to rett > . v « thesa petitioners without giving v nt to strong political opinions . He thought tbe question of the Com Laws was foreign to the subject ; and if tho prajer of the petition wis granted , it would aggravate the distress which existed , it would ucseUle all classes , and be a great interrKption te busi l
ness . He deepy regretced the misery which existed . He did notbkme one Government more than another , but he did say , there had beeira . neglect on the part of each successive Government , acd tho interests , welfare , and comfort of tbs people dvrel . inginlarg « towns had not been attended to . ( Hear . ) He wished the house would direct its attention to practical measures for the relief of the distressed , and not be to much occupied with political contests —( hear)—from day to day . He , however , should vote against tke motion .
Mr . O'CONNELL would not trouble the House but a few minutes ; but as he had taken such a decided part against the Chartists out of doer * , he felt bound shortly to state his opinions in the House . He was favouiable to gome parts of the petition , but to seme he objected . He was not an advocate for Annual Parliaments . ( Hear . ) If ^ ectiens took place every year they would » qt excite any interest ; they would be lookel upou with , indifference , and , consequently , there would not , in all probability , be so good a selection as at present . He , howef . r , enndidly admitted that he was a Radical Reformer—( hear )—aud was anxious to . extend tke Suffrage to the utmost possible limit which it could be extended to with safety ; bathe could not consent to Universal
buttrage , a . s that would bo impracticable . ( Hear . ) Though opposed to Universal Soffrage and Annual Parliaments , he conld not admit that any Englishman should ba deprived of hia vete . He did not know that in this country , as in the West Indies , there was a master class and a slave claw . There was , indeed , a master dags , and if ho could see an advantage gained by that class with respect to physical and moral pow er , he might be disposed to , confine the franchise to it ; but that was cot the case , and he would not give any advantage over the working clfca . The Right Honourable and Learned Gentleman ( Sir E . Sugden ) said last aiiiht that taxation and representation should go together . It waa a flippant speech withresnect tornnnda .
A Chartist could not have delivered a better . ( Laughter . ) It was said the attempt to take taxes without representation was robbery upon the rights of their country . This he admitted . The proportion of those who enjoyed the elective franchise in England was no more than 19 per cent , of the population . In Ireland four per cent . onWhad the nght of voting . Wa » it to be endured that 81 per cent , of the people of England should remain without remain without tho franchise ? The natter should be regulated in England and Ireland . Th-y did not give to tho labouring men the value of their wages , and yet they excluded them Jbecause they could not inhabit a £ 10 hcuss . This " was adding degradation to wron / r . He did not wish tn « rt »>
upon the Ballot though favourable to it . Triennial Parliaments he should aapport , and he was not opposed to Payment of Members for their services in that' House . . ( Hear , hear . ) With respect to the distresses of the working classes , it mustbe obvious to every one that suffering murt occasionally occar . Amongst a number of operatives distress would often accumulate ; changes in trade , sickness , and other carabine * , brought on poverty and discontent . The Honourable and Learned G . ntlemnu thought the ChartMtahad not acted discreetly . 1 he present exclusive system of votirg for Members ojthat House would bavo yielded long sine- but for the miscondtct of the Chartists . If they had not gone to tbe Savings * Bank * , which he considoied it
weaKness—they had not attacked the middling classes , theginewandbc-neof the country , bnt Lad relied on principle , advocating the qriettide ol society , they might have derived advantage from public sympathy , wlich was the only legitimate resource they had . Howu sorry the Noble Lcrd had fpoken of democratic feeling , in rathe " , he murt say , schoolboy terms . The Noble Lord mig ^ t apeak of the fluctuation of currency in America , but that was no answer that America was prcperou * . They had paid eff their national debt . Where vrn * tbere a country more fr e than America wa * ? After some general observations on thu cendirion of democratic Athens in former time ? , and tho
prosperity of Switzerland , Norway , Swedftn ,-De . nniwk , and Belgium , in the present day , he taid there could not be too much enconregem'ut given to the ' ffjrti of the people of England to get the whole of their interest represented , and not a part . ( Htar . ) He was favourable to that part of the petition which callrd for a more extensive representati n . He would go into committre , if there was the le * t chance of obtaining it ; in short , he vould vote lor Extension of the Soffrage , the Ballot , for d ictf away the QaaHfication of Members of Parliament , and lor Conitituencitu paying the expenses of their Represent stives . He was not disposed to ndvoc » te h breach of the law , but would assent to a prop o « - tion for a committee .
Mr . WALLACEsaid he nhouW vote for the copmittt ^ e , although he did not support the proposition for Universal Suffrage . He wa 3 fnvourable to Triennial Parliaments , the Ballot , and Paid Represantatives . ( Hear . ) He agreed to tha ab olition of the (^ aahfication for Members . With respect to tne petibon , he wcnld saj-, if 1 , 200 , 000 thinking ffl en were of oneopinioa upon the points he had xnes * tioned , it would'be presumption in hiai to differ "t ? them—indeed , he might be induced to give up iw opinion upon Universal Suffrage and Annual r ** * liament * , entertainicg aa he did a respect fo : so m ' ( I body of the people . { Continued in our seventh page )
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¦ r % THE OT ^ THERN STAR . . rft ... . ¦< i ' ¦ —^ ^ m ^^ tB ^ n ^^^^^^^
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Citation
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Northern Star (1837-1852), July 20, 1839, page 6, in the Nineteenth-Century Serials Edition (2008; 2018) ncse.ac.uk/periodicals/ns/issues/vm2-ncseproduct1066/page/6/
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