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HOUSE OF COMMONS . —Fbtday , Jose 16 . In the HoBse of Commons , some 4 » nversation arose jrfpecSng the Stade Unties , » nd th » present state of oni jiesotiatiaBS ¦ witb _ Banover xespectinx fiiem . The jnhBtance of flffl jeplies of Sit ^ oberi ; Petl and Mr . ^ jlajjstone io guesHons asked by lord Palmerston , Dt 3 owring , » fl 2 ^ Butt , -was , £ ha $ Blatters still jemained iaflpflrftB * ad unsettled , though the British {^ venaneB $ - " » ouia praibaby soon be induced to make Tip itsaDnidon-thBsubject . " 313 Princess . AkjuBU * Annuity BUI -was proposed for a second reading , on-which iHttHo ^ CE suggested tti ° propriety or making HjmB pirarision lor the family of his laia Royal Badness the Dais of Snssex . He did net expect any present answer to Ms proposition , and none -was fflTEQ .
air . Sjjmx then said that he shonia take a dmaon tai the second leadii-g of the Bffl . A division according }; took place , -when there appeared Por the second reading .......,.,.,.. Agsinst it- „_ . ™ 37 Majority 104
IRISH ARMS BUi . Ths adjourned debate on lie Inab . Arms Bill -was resumed by 3 &t Stutvmas Cra-wfokd , -who traced the discontent of the tenantry to their treatment fey the landlords , and -pressed on the { xovermsst tie importance « f undertaking some remedy for their -wrongs and sufferings . 3 ji l ^ BOT defended the Irish landlord * , and expressed Ins i ^ retihat iliey should De msde the subject if constant stt&et . ^ t Basixg Waix -sras satisfied that if the 6 o-Tennaent -would announce its intention of . governing Ireland en eondliatory instead of -coercive measnres , it -would do more to repress agitation than anything they conld attempt . He Tiighly disapproved of £ he present inH 3 Trtifeh was inopportune and injudicious .
Mi . Phtlip Hottxed , -viewing the bill as unconjgtntionsl , conld not support it He hoped it -would ie referred to a select committee , in order to be xe-¦ ymyflcTWT Mr- T . Stnart jremariBd upon the feet , that the CaSholie majority of Ireland had been long governed by the Protestant minority . A "want of confidence -was the jaatnral result of tlfis state of things . Bnt though Jjs disapproved of any thing -which -would have the tendency of placing Ireland under -nwTti » i lair , he trsold rapport the *™« Bill in its present stage , because he fels that it "ubs required , merely reserving to liTTOgftf the light of supporting all amendments in committee-which-wonld remove or Tmftg ^ fa its objee-JlOSiable liwi f ifclnrpf .
Mr . BEDE 5 GTO 5 considered Hib present state of Ireland to be due to the policy of the present Goremment . If lavs -were passed for -fiiB benefit of lsndlords , they , should also do something towards teaching the landlords irhat -were their duties . The present Bill revived unconstitutional enactments , not justified by any of the previous Bills of more recent date . The Irish msmbsis -were -angeneronsiy taunted "with liaving assented to preceding Arms Billsj but their successful efforts against coercive measures -were forgotten , as 'well as the fact -ihst , tinder the administration of a friendly Executive , they had been compelled , by the opposition of Sir Robert Peel and bis Enpporters , to adopt measures -which they irould otherwise have resisted .
3 Ir . Escoxi believed that the real cause of the yresant state of Ireland , as compared -with -what it iras under the Whiga , arose from the fact that fiie present Government did not choose to place the patronage of that country at the disposal of Mr .
OXkamelL 2 &x . Sergeant Hcbpht contended that the discontent of the Irish people arose from a conviction of real and substantial ^ wrongs . Coupled - with file fact of the dismissal © £ Magistrates , in "whom the people had confidence , the probability -sras , that the present bill -would tend to arm the Protestants , anil to disarm the Catholies . He -would oppose any Anns BID , T » hsther proposed by Whig to Tory ; and he could not conceive that this -was a time for such a measure , "when it had been incontestably proved that crime in Ireland -was steadOy £ e-
sreaang . It gave a po-srer to the Magistracy -which conld hardly escape abesa ; in illustration of -which he told a remarkable instance , in "which thB mother of a family , in the absence of her husband , bad beea transported en the charge of concealing arms—a fact "Which drove her- husband to the " "wSd justice of Jevenge , 15 by -which bis own life and that of the committing Magistrate -were sacrificed . The only mode of abating thB Bepeal-agitation -was to -wipe a-R-ay all invidiouB laws from Sis statute-book , and place TJngKsftmen and Irishmen on a footing of perfect equality .
Colonel Co >~ oklt loosed upon the Repeal agitation -as involving a craaade against property . It seemed to -fmn ^ iat ithft cicnnjEtancBS of Ireland imperatively called for such a Bill as tie present 28 x . Tuns , conceded the point that an Arms Bill "was required ior Ireland , but did not think that it should contain so many penal provisions as the present one . He-deprecated iac exaggerated statements respecting the uumbers attending Repeal meetingB in Ireland , "which "were - calculated to excite unnecessary alarm ; irsm his own tnowledgB , be knew that the 2 dullingar meeting , "which "was said to have been attended by Heady 200 , 000 individuals , could sot have comprised more than-12 , 000 . Penal measures ought ts be preceded by conciliatory o » es ; and these he -would support , come from -what Government they might .
Sir Kobeet Jkkl adverted to the story told by Mr . Sergeant ilnrpcy , -which occurred twenty-eight years ago ,-when le was Chief Secretary of Ireland . A magistrate , -who bad taken an active part in bringing individuals to justice in a case of gross outrage , -was murdered by a conspiracy formed -against him ; a xeward of five thousand pounds was offered for the discovery of the mnrdersrs ; the individual -who had organised the conspiracy became the informer , and he - { Sir Bsbsri Feel ) had himself paid two thousand pounds to the betrayer of those -whom he bad seduced inio the crime , sand bad been threatened by him -with an action of « foTn » pa « for sot havinj ? paid the remainder . Cases iiVf » t ^ " rather strengthened the argn-Tnwif » in . favour of the Bill , -which "was not intended for any political object , bnt to secure the rights and safety of the people .
JLc Roebuck overlooked the fact that the present Mil "was a renewal of previons gn « r $ mp-nt « - The law "was temporary ^ and on « ach re-enactment it " » as expedientthat a caseakould be made out for the measure . The state of Ireland did not at present justify any extraordinary measure ; and thB bill-was simply perni-43 OSS . Under it a -man might get his arms branded with the name of an unsuspecting neighbour , and having committed murder , contrive that the blame should fall on the innocent individual . The "whole country 'wasoneTastgarriBon ; the people felt that they "were oppressed , not only by distinctions , bat by measures * hich "wets an insult as-well as an injury . ThBChurch ' was the cancerous sore , the great abomination , of Ireland ; and though , doubtless , they "were excited bydemagojnes -who converted pnblic ; wrong into private ad"Tantage , thecanBes of their discenteists "were real and
mbstaafiaL Reverse the case . ; place the Orangeman under the Roman Catholic priesthood , and compel him 1 a support the goigeens Church of Rome , from -which he derived no advantage , and we should speedily heai aa outcry from the Consllys , converted into 0 'ConneHs . SrBobert Peel had been dracsed into a blunder , in onnnendng a -war -with magistrates for attesding meet-* Bga to discuss » subject -which they had as much right to entertain as the House to argue tbe question now l > efore thsm . Here he "was , onthefiooi of the House of tJinnmons , declaring , in language not to be mistaken , fiathe "washed the downfal of the Church of Ireland : ¦» as tliat a sufficient cause for depriving him of any hangar -which he possessed , or to interfere -with his : J 5 ghta ? looking to the circumstances of the country , on the Terge of a convulsion , he believed that tbe most EnsflbifiVDns measure "which could be passed -was tbs irahArmsBilL
f ' ir Ja 3 ees fiiAKUJ contrasted the topics unfed ¦* ith the mo&m on -which they -were advanced . Not OBly in Ireland , -with all thB accompaniments of ^ 'rilal preparation , but in the House , the destruction ol the Church of Ireland -was insisted on * - as a condifionof paace ; from -whence he drew an argument as toihe expediency and necessity of tbe bill , in order to lbs due Tn » -iTi ^ xTWTifp of law and oideii Addressiiyf ^ Jtelftothestatistacsof yr-Pigot , in hia speech of * h » previous evening , he adduced figures to show that rSaSvdy to the population , crime -was much more * tofflasnt in Ireland ' -tTwn in Enslasd ; « nd adverting ^ ° the large measures of concession or conciliation "which k « B been passed since the Act of Emancipation .
declared that the great quesfioEs insideiitally raised as to ^ ie Protstant church , fixity of ttnure , said so forth , » ae fkrtoo important to be discussed casually on a Motion Bke the present . He , and olher advocates ol CaihoQc Emandpatidn , had ^ upportad it , on the unfiersbnding flat the Established Ghnrch -was thereby Iffl QEred ^ nore £ scure . Tet aetj the position at which "We had" now -arrived , "when , after conciliation -in IrekaaTsa been carried to its utmost extent , it was s « d « at nothing but the overthrow of the Protestant Church and " Sxity-ot tenure" "would satisfy the de-: B * ad « of lh » Roman Catholics . Confining himse J tw fiabm before the House , and looking to the txisting *^ e of Irdand , he antiopated- tbatifwonld be car-» £ d by an overwhelming majority .
Lord John Rtsssii conld not lafns&to the present ^^^ en nceBt powers "which he himself , as a member of She late ^ oTeriment , had felt » be necessary . But he aw- jio xeason lor giving new and extraordinary ^• ers , such as-were ssketi by Represent BilL Tbe ^*« h of Sir James feiham conveyed tbe imprtssion « at he congiflered the Roman Catholics were nuS itffi-^^^ 7 gratefnifcr the concessions which ba-i been maae wthem . Snch an opinion , coming from a Cabinet ¦* £ ™* t « r » -would make a deep impression . The Whig « ° * fcrnrnents of 1806 and 1 S 35 , in renewing the Arms ^ Os . lad ^ wfiTnpyri ^ tjiem ^ j ^ preDOidUons ior the ^ provenYent and arelfare of Ireland * : a ^ d tht lare G 3 T en 2 ment had laboured to bestow on Qsat country rbe ^^ m mdcrpal fraachma as that cf Etgiaed , as "well ** &bsr beefffirjal enactments ; but tfcty -Bv-re resist **! , ^^ after year , untfl they "were glad to secure for the
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Irishpeople-srhat they had done . Fixity of tennre was » roy eapttwHng phrase , and catealatedtoexeitsthe people "W ^ h fUladous « xp « 5 taHons am snbject wa » * n « fiti for oonsideaHon . England and Scotland had eaeha Cbareh establishment fo ? the majority qt their lespecHTe T » pnlstioa «; and if they -were to PIOCS \ fc 5 ^ malogyi « ie Roman CathoHo Chureh w > ld be established in Ireland . Had his appropriation measure been adopted , he believed it -wouia hare been beneficial ; as it was , their course -was encompassed with difficulties . He -wonld raise the Sornan- € atholie Church , not depress the Protestant -Bst ^ blisbnient ; bnt nobody could affirm that the present condiSon of the ecclesiastical establishment of
Ireland rested on a permanent basis , lord Eliot had lefosed personal compliments , at the expense of tlie Ctovemment Triln "which he - was conneeted . 'In that case * he was compelled to say , that the Government ¦ was -wholly unfitted to manage Ireland in the dim " , cult circumstances in -which it found itself placed The Government might Taunt that It had a great majority in the House , but in doing so it but imitated tie bad example of Mr . O'Connell , -when he turned the people against the " Saxon . " He hoped that the Government instead of imitating the spirit of either the lord High Chancellor or thB Homo Secretary , "wonld think better of their high duties , and preserve to the Crown the affection of the loyal Irish peopl&
lard Stasibt charged lord John Russell with the guilt of throwing fee great weight of ins character into the critical circumstances of Ireland , and thereby irifia-rmne an excitable people to madness , for the mere sake of gratifying his spirit of opposition against the Government If the people of Ireland had not hitherto been treated en a footing of equality , lord John Russell must bear his share of tbe ibsponaibilits and tie hlsms , xeeing that when the Reform Bill -was passing , he had joined in resisting all attempts to extend the franchise . Hia own celebrated Franchise Bfllrwhich was the stalking horse of the Tory party when In opposition , he protested was not brought for-¦ ward in a party spirit ; and nothing more surprised him
than to find it converted into an engine of party contention , lord John Russell found fault "with the Church in Ireland , bnt was not prepared to bring forward a -motion on it , though Mr . Ward and Mr . Boebuck avowed that they were ready to do so . He wished that the motion were made , in order to see how they stood upon that subject . The -wealth and the property of the United Kingdom were in favour of the present Government ; and in the midst of much of invectiva , no accusation had been preferred by lord John Russell which rested on any very intelligible grounds ; and he trnsted that the Houbo would ge into committee on the Arms "Bill , in order to give a dne consideration to its provisions .
. Mr . More 0 * FBaiuiL affirmed that the Irish Catholics had acquiesced in the accession of the present Government to power ; if they had not felt it their duty to support it , they at least had not given it any factious opposition . But the sentiments of Sir James Graham , in his speech of that evening , were not deserved by tha Irish Catholics , and were calculated to -create great excitement in Ireland . It was not Catholics who , in the course of the debate , " had recommended the abrogation of the Established Church . Sir Charles Napieb moved the adjournment of the debate , on which a division was called for ; when there appeared—For the adjournment ... .... ... 67 Against it ... „ . ... 235 Majority 1 « 8 Captain Bekkelet then explained his reasons for bis vote .
Mr . Gisboenb next moved the adjournment of the debate . Mr . M . J . O'Cossell , whs had been alluded to by lord Stanley , said it was nnfyy to place him in tbe position of either eulogist or apologist of Mr . OConnell ; but whatever might be considered the violence of his distinguished relative ' s expressions , they could not do more Tniorfiipf than tbe expressions -which had been fised by Sir James Gbahjjm that evening . ; Mr . Philip Ho"WjlBD also repelled the insinuations conveyed in Sir J . Graham ' s speech . SirH . W . BAB . E . 0 S also termed Sir James Graham ' s language " insulting" to his country and his Catholic fellow-countrymen . Sir James Gkaham asked for a specification of the expressions which were alleged against him as insulting .
Mr . P . Howard said that Sir James Graham had irmnnaled that the Catholic nobility and gentry had violated their oaths . Sir H . TV " . Baskon , Mr . Wtsb , and lord Clements cod firmed t ^" as their impression of the meaning of the langnage employed . Sir Jakes Graham disclaimed all intention of conveying any snch impression . Mr . Resin gto > " said that the calm tone and quiet manner of Sir James Graham had in some measure removed the indignant feeling which he had originally felt The O'Co > 'OB Do >~ also accepted tbe explanation . The debate was then adjourned . Mosdat , Juke 19 .
Sir Robkbt Peel in reply to Mr . Hindley , expressed his strong sympathy with the Regent of Spun , who , in the midst of many difficulties , had acted up to the responsibilities of his high station ; and should he "be driven from powei , he wonld still Save the consolation of knowing that he had mainly contributed to lay the foundations of constitutional Government ; in Spain . Mr- Ferbasd moved foi reSorns of the names of persons -who save been appointed governors of the Stipton Union Wotkhonse during the last two years , with tha reasons why they resigned , or were dismissed from the office ; also a copy of all communications addressed to , or received from the Poor law Commissioners by the Board of Guardians , relating to any charges brought against Mr . C . Mottram , master of the said Union Workhouse , with the proceedings of the
board thereon ; of the names and ages of all inmates of the said "Union Workhouse ( as well as of the namej of their parents ) who are now , or who have been employed in any factory since the 1 st day of January last , with the number of hours per day they have bewi compelled to work , as well as of the amount of their wages , and of the names of the persons to whom the same have been pait ?; and stating whether the owner of the factory is a member of the said Board of Guardians , and whether the employment of the said inmates -was sanctioned by the Board of Guardians , by the Poor law Commissioners , or by any Assistant Poor law Commissioner . Also , a copy of all contracts for food , clothing , coals and timber , which have been entered into by the said BoaTd of GuardianB , since the formation of the Union , with any member , or with any one in partnership with any number of the said board .
Ordered . HOW TO " MANAGE- PETITIONS . In reply to Mr Hindley , Sir James G&aham said that the Government'in tended to proceed with the Factories * Bill , though the omission of tbe edncational clauses would render some alteration of the details necessary . Accordingly , a motion was made by Sir James Graham , that tbe House should go into committee , in order to introduce the necessary details ; but Mr . ChsistoPHEE said he had to call the attention of the House to SSsubject involving a gross breach of the privileges of the House , and . a great abuse of the right of petitioning , urbich would , he thought , be deemed sufficient to justify the motion with which he meant to
conclude . It would be recollected that on tbe 9 th of May last the Hon . Member for Preston had presented what purported to be a petition from the inhabitants of Hepworth , a purely agricultural parish in Lincolnshire , containing a prayer to the effect , that " although the petitioner * -were inhabitants of an agricultural district , th felt tbe com and provision laws to be greatly iijurions ; aitd , believing them to be the cause of the existing distress , they prayed that they might be repealed , as arbitrarily and oppressively interfering with the wise and beneficient designs of Providence , and tending to deprive the people of theirdaiiy bread . " 2 f o » , whether from pubHcatioD in tbB papers , or from some other notice , tht inhabitants of Hep worth became acquainted wiflj tbe fact ol sucb a pretended petition
having been presented , and a public meeting was held , at which a counter petition was prepared , to tbe effect that the former one " had been a forg «? ry . and that tbe owners and occupiers of the parish wished for an inquiry into tae circumstances attending the ptrp-tiatian of the fraud , which had now become too common , ana by wnicn the opinions of -constituencies "were too often ttras misrepresented . " At first he declined to jirestnt &uch petition , and , requesting further evidence , the vestry-clerk" of the parish < witb which be had be * n in connexion for upwards ; of thirry yeare ) bad st-at up a " daclaration" ( in place of an affidavit ) m-. de before a magistrate , upon examination of an authenticated copy of the signatures to th « petition , of which declaration the following -aoa ine Mibsi&nce-- ' That ont of all the 213 names attached
to the petition , H bad been fonnd that only three ptrzoss bad sinned feno-wing its prayer ; and tea mere had siEEed because they were informed it prayed for cheap tea and snt ; ar ; one of the three atoo was now a prisoner in the House of Correction—( hear;—and seventy or eighty were the names of parties not known in the parish at all ; "while the residue of tbe names were j * . « iuv *] y fjrged . " Under such circumstances , nothing remained to be said ; and * s he found that in 1827 « n a sicrOaT event occurring , with respect to an Ai&lone election petition , the subject was referred to a select committee , on the report of which subsequently the parties to tie fraud had been apprehended aDdiimprisoned by oraer of the bouse , be should now propose that the same course be adopted , and moved that | the petitions 2 » a « x » rdiD * iy referred—< b « fr > . i StxickiaKsaid iving notice © £ lie
Sir G » , on rece , c ' rcua » ta ces be had of course made inquiries , and had fouBd that he had net received the petition from } the tendon Anti-Corn I * "" Association , but from a similar aLocation at DoncMter-Uronical «**» of Hear , btar n He had -written to some of the parties whose names were to tbe petition , and their replies confirmed ThTatateifceDtsof tbe Hon . Gentleman- | hear , hear ) He had aUo received a letter from the secretary toj the AnG-Cvra L »* Association at Doncaster , which s ^ ted in subtree " tbst the person who had t&tea the pafc-« , „ wmworth hsd been recomn ; enc «! to them as a 2 SSSKSSUln « lcalai- of hear ; , _ and tbatfc , ^ n ^ ni ^ tLTfraud-lh ^ -aadu . s , that wdstof S " wm * b * bad obtained were given under a promise
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tfeat he would not disclose them for that they were fearful of the fact being discovered —( hear ) . Nor was this confined to Hepworth ; foe it had been found that agriculturists generally had been afraid to sign such petitions—( hear )—so abject was ths bondage in which they were held—( ironical cries of hear , hear , and oh , oh !) The secretary said , further ,- that he did not know what motives could have induced the person they employed to commit snch a fraud- ^ -tfronical cheers }—and that they had carefnlly cautioned him against obtaining other thanionajWe signatures—( continued ironical cheers )—nor could they imagine bow he could have found time in one day to forge 119 signatures —( a laugh , and hear , The anti Corn law leaguecould have no wish to screen such persons —( hear , hBar •)—bnfc it was proper to put tbe saddle on the right horse— ( loud cries of hear , hear ) —and thinking that a » oinniKtee might have tbe effect of discovering some facts ¦ important in the case , he should support the motioni-lbear , hear ) . The motion was accordingly carried .
THE KING GE HANOVER . Mr . Blewitt rose , according to notice , to put a question of the deepest importance to her Majesty ' s Attorney-General It respected the extraordinary position occupied by the King ? of Hanover , who , while by birth owing allegiance to the British Crown , and moreover a peer of Parliament and a Field-Marshal , also exercised the rights of &a independent , if not arbitrary , monarch abroad . It did not appear possible how bis Majesty could exercise properly rights so utterly at variance . As a peer of rthe British Parliament he claimed the right of sitting in the House of Lords , and of intruding on the councils of the Executive , — ( laughter , ) while , as a Marshal in the British army , he might claim the privilege of leading the troops of this
country— . ( laughter )—even when at war with it - < loud laughter . ) Hon . Gentlemen might laugh—( hear )—bnt the very absurdity of the thing was hie chief complaint . That admirable constitutional lawyer , Blackstene , in his Commentaries , laid it down that by changing hia country a British subject -would not change his allegiance ; and again , that the peera of Parliament were the hereditary councillors of the Crown , and as such had : a right to advise it on all matters important to tbe . pnblic welfare . So anomalous was the King ' s pesiiioa , that it had been said that the Duke of Wellington had declined his Majesty ' s proxy when offered . In conclusion , the Hon . Gentleman said he hoped the Learned Gt-utleman would not forget his oath of office , —( laughter , )—and not answer , or decline to answer , from " fear , favour , or affection "—( Laughter ) . The Hon . Member then referred to his question , which Ptood thus upon the
Totes : — " On the motion for reading the order of the day , to ask a question 6 f Her Majesty's Atterney-General whbther , in his opinion , it is consistent with the constitution and the conflicting duties of His Hanoverian Majesty , as King of Hanover and Duke of Cumberland , that his said Majesty shonld take bis seat in the House of lords and exercise hia right as a peer of the realm and councillor of the Queen . In care the Attorney-General should decline to answer that qnestion , to move as an amendment to tbe motion for reading the orfier of the day , that an humble address be presented to Her Majesty , praying that Her Majesty will be graeiously pleased to revoke any license -which Her Majesty may have granted to enable His Royal Highness the Duke of Cumberland to vote by proxy in the House of Lords ; and that Her Mnjasty wDl further be graciously pleased not to renew such license while Mb Royal Highness shall remain King of Hanover . "
The Attobnet- General said , he had every deairo to discharge the duties of his office properly ; but he thought , sincerely , that on the present occasion he should beBt discharge his : duty by declining to answer the question—( crieB of " Hear , hear" ) . Mr . Blewitt intimated , that owing to a private suggestion from the Speaker ( on a point of order ) , he had been led to believe that he could not proceed with the remaining part of his notice .
THE FACTORY BILL . Sir J . Gbahas , in answer to Mr . T . Doncombe , stated that it was not pie intention of tbe Government to abandon any portion of the factory Bill except the educational clauses—( hear , hear . ) Those clauses having been abandoned , various alterations in detiil became neoessary . He should ' propose , that the bill be recommitted pro forma to enable him to make them ; when the bill would be published precisely in the form in which he should propose it again —( hear ,
hear . ) If it were the pleasure of the House , he should wish to tale the committal as soon as possible—( hear , hear )—and as it stood on the orders for to-night , perhaps it could be taken now . " On the order for the committal of the bill being read , lord Ashley said , although he deeply regretted the Ion of the educational clauses , he , for tbe sake of the rest of the bill approved of the resolution the Government had come to . Even had it been possible for tbe Government to have carried the measure in that House , he did not think it would have met with that cordial
sympathy and co-operation from the different classes affected by it , without which it could not have been effectually carried ont . It should be borneiin mind , that the Church , with 3 view to conciliation , were ready to make the very largest concessions , larger certainly than they had ever done before ; but concessions made in tbe hope of conciliation and peace . Bnt when they found that tbe terms -which they propoasd , so far from leading to conciliation and peace , only led to . greater disunion and almost to effectual war , they had no
alternative but to stop , at all events at tbe point to which they had already advanced . Somewhere or other , however , a very great and deep responsibility did lie—fhear , hear . ) It was not for him to point out who were the parties really responsible for tbe position at which they had now arriveJ . He certainly must say that the Government had shown their readiness to act . Be saw the church prepared to make concessions for tbe sake of conciliation and peace , and on the other hand be saw the great body of Dissenters rejoicing that they had been successful in their efforts to defeat the measure .
Wherever the fault lay , one thing was quite clear—that the really suffering parties were tbe vast body of neglected children , who , as far as present appearances went , were new consigned to ut eternity of ignorance . ( Hear ) . At the same time , however , that be deplored the result to which the measure bad come , he must be allewed to express his satisfaction at tbe manner in which it bad been received and entertained in the first instance ; and at the absence of ail violence with which it had bees received by the Dissenters in that House . That reception did sertainly afford some ground for hoping that hereafter something might effectually be done to arrest tbe further progress of vice , ignorance , and immorality in the country by means of some system of education . At present , however , it appeared tbat if united education were to become hereafter possible , tbe question was at present involved in tbe greatest
difficulty , and it was one that had already produced the greatest agitation in the country . He , for one , therefore , was prepared to say , that unless a very mighty change should take place in tbe mutual temper ef both parties , he would never be a party to any system , the object of which was , by mutual concession , to bring antagonist parties to act together in the same general plan . Once more , he desired to express his gratitude for the manner in which the proposition bad been first received , and since entertained , and also to state his cordial hope and prayer that the time was not far distant wben some means might be discovered whereby tbe men and women of this country in future generations might be put into that state which would : fit them to be good subjects , and above all , Christians , and extend to them the fruits of a religious education , by preparing them to share in a blessed immortality . ( Hear , hear . )
Mr . M . Gibson could not understand how it was that the Noble lord used the word " concession , " as regarded tbe conduct of the church with respect to the education clauses of the Factory Bill—( hear , hear . ) He protested against the use of that word , " conces" sion . * —{ hear , bear ) . On the contrary , he could tell the Noble Lord that it was because the framera of tbat measure bad proceeded on tie doctrine tbat there was some recognised superiority in Churchmen—( "hear , hear , " from the Ministerial benches )—some sort of divine right in them—( hear , hear )—to trample on the religious liberty of the Dissenters—( "No , no "); and to take the money of the Dissenters to teach the tenet * of the Church of England—( hear , hear ;)—it was because you persisted is recognising this sort of superiority
that you have failed injaecomplishing the object of a general system of education . Proceed on tbe real principle of religious freBdom ; let men not be treated with reference to their theological opinions , but simply as citizens of a free conntry , ' having the right to worship their God in their own "way , freely according to their own conscience ; adopt this as the principle of legislation , and it wonld not fail . ( Hear , bear , from the Opposition benches . ) Bnt , in fact , the N « ble Lord a remark about the concessions , as he called them , of the cUurch having failed , only amounted to an admi * biou tbat the church had not conceded enough . Treat all stcts in the spirit of justice , and never fear for the accomplishment of the benevolent object they had in ¦ v ic-w—( hear . ) Even , however , if the Ministerial plan had been carried , it must be admitted that U was a
very partial and pitiful proposal , considering the great amount of destitution : with regard to religious education tbat prevailed in tbe manufacturing districts . It was admitted by all . parties that tbe measure now abandoned would sot have caused tbe education cf a single chUa in the large" city of Glasgow , and of not many more in the manufacturing districts in England , than were educated now ; for it was only intended to apply to cotton , flax , silk , and woollen factories ; and it left the children in mines and collieries , and in many other employments , wholly unprovided with education . The small amount of education that would have been afforded by the mtasure was one reason for not so much xsgrettang its rejection . ; It "was a plan that could not have effected much good , but which wasceitaln , on the other hand , to have done much barm—( hear , hear ) . '
Sir B , Inglts hoped that Ministers would not abandon their principle . If they had taken a more uncompromising course , they would have bad a stronger snpport from a large body of tbe well-wishers of their measure . Mr . Hikdlet thanked the Government fer having abstained from pressing' this measure , as their strength might have eaabled them to do . He denied that the Church bad given up anything , and hoped that in another session tbe Cfinrchmen would tee the fitness of acting very differently . Sir G . Gret considered tbia failure as by no
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means absolving the Ministers from the obligation of looking to the education of tbe people . He would advise them to increase the annual Parliamentary grants . | Some further conversation followed , in tbe course of which Sir J . Graham intimated that tha Government would gladly recommend an increase of tbe Parliamentary grant , if voluntary contributions shonld be raised in qbo proportion to it . : An attempt was made by Sir V . Blake to introduce a discussion irespeoting the precautionary measures lately applied in Ireland > upon the plea of their involving a | breach of privilege ; bnt the Speaker , decided ! that the topic was not of such a class as to be entitled to precedence of the orders of the day . i The adjourned debate on the Irish Arms Bill was then resumed .
Mr . Gisborne was the first who addressed himself to this exhausted subject . He criticised tbe tone of the speech delivered by Sir J . Graham on Friday , atod contended that tbe question of the Irish Church was a topic not improperly introduced into the discussions of the preceding nights . sHe disapproTtfd the conduct of the Government in dismissing the magistrates who had attended Repeal meetings , and in appointing Judges who , though men jof high honour and character , had evinced in the House of Commons what . ifor want of a better word , he must designate as bigotry . A person of the anti-Protestant party whs should be tried before them would reasonably feel misgivings like tbose of tbe poacher , who , being summoned before a couple of Norfolk justices for killing a cock pheasant , told them tbey might just as well try him befpre a jury of cock pheasants .
Mr . Colquhoun maintained that the state of Ireland required an Arms : Bill . Witnesses and Jurors in that country were in danger of their lives for the evidence and tae verdicts conscientiously given by them . Individuals were denounced .. . by the priests from the very altars , and thus placed in a state of frightful insecurity , for no crime but that of voting for Protestant candidates . He cited examples of these things from the eviden « e given before thB Lords' Committee on Ireland , and argued tbat Ireland thua differed so widely from England as reasonably | to require laws which in England would bo inapplicable . He enlarged upon the
peculiarities of the Repeal agitation , as furnishing additional reasons for this < legislative precaution . He read extracts from speeches and songs Of the Repealers , breathing as fierce a hatred against the Whigs as against tbe Tories , and thence rebutted the assertion that all which was , wanting for the tranquilization of Ireland was to restore the Whig Ministry . It web not true tbat the whole body of the Irish Roman Catholics adhered to tbe present movement party of Ireland ; and it was the duty of the Government to protect those peaceable subjects of her Majesty from the terrors ef an unconstitutional agitation .
Mr . Williams said , that Ireland would be quiet enough if the Government and Parliament of England showed a disposition to do her justice . : < Lord J . Manners referred to Mr . Roebuck's repetition of the proposal for paying tbe Irish priesthood—a proposal based upon a most undue belief in the powers of Mammon . That priesthood w ; is not to be silenced . Indeed , it had been well said of that plan , that there are two objections to it—first , tbat the priests were not willing to be bought ; and , secondly , that we were not willing to buy them . It was not historically true , that the religion of Route was the ancient religion of Ireland ; it had been first introduced by Henry II ., and formed part of tbe very system of English conquest against which the ; agitators were so loudly protesting . He feared tbat no material benefit was to be secured for Ireland , unless some improvement could be made in the physical condition of her people .
Sir H . W . Barron , alluding to Sir J . Graham ' s enumeration of tbe concessions made to Ireland , contended tbat they were concessions made only from fear , and in the most ungracious mannar . Emancipation had been forced . Retorm had been stinted . Then as to the Church [ property ; it was proved by history and by tbe statutes to have been destined for three purposes—religion , education , and the relief of the poor ; but it was not now so applied—a great portion of it was spent in keeping up Protestant livings where there were no Pratestant congregations . There was no such preponderance in the amount of crime in Ireland over tbe amount of crime in England , as to justify the enactment of this special law against tbe Irish people—nay , the proportion of crime was greater in
England ; and though Sir J . Graham bad presented a contrary view , yet ; when certain returns should be produced which would be moved for , Sir J . Graham ' s view would be disproved . Sir H . Barron then attacked the bill in detail . The act , aa renewed by the Whigs , was free from the objectionable clauses of this biU . He did not mean to speak disrespectfully of the present ministers ; but he would say that the whole Irish people was against them , by reason of the judges whom they had , appointed , and of tbe stipendiary magistrates whom they bad dismissed . Tbe Bishops too had been selected from tha enemies of National Education . The Gibinet itself was wholly disconnected from Ireland ; not a single member of it was Irish ; and
accordingly no measure bad been introduced by it for the redress pf any Irish grievance . The Church was not tbe only grievance of Ireland : she bad many others -which requited the attention of Government . It bad been said , that the wealth and intelligence of the country were with Ministers ; but London and the other great cities , were a good criterion of these , and tbe majority of their representatives were adverse to the Government . Nay , even the counties , which had at first been with -the ministers , -would be found against them if they ventured on a dissolution now . He admonished them tbat the Catholics were no longer a powerless race , but equal to the Protestants in every civil riaht . 1
Mr . Hardytook tbe real question to be , whether there were not in Ireland extraordinary circumstances , requiring this extraordinary remedy . If there were * then that man was an unreasonable man ! who would not submit to a little particular inconvenience for tbe sake of general security . Ho referred to the analogy of the law under which tbs houses of people employed in the woollen manufactures of Yorkshire and Lancashire may be entered , for the purpose of putting them to the pro » f tbat any woollen goods found there have been honestly come by ; that was a law reversing the general rule of proof , and a lave not extending to the kingdom at large . Mr . Hardy proceeded , at some length , to deal with several of the general topics of Irish politics ; but tbo impatience of the House made it difficult to apprehend Ha arguments .
Mr . E . Ellice , though he bad supported the former bills on this snbject , felt himself obliged to oppose tbia , as a part of a system of coercion , for the Government bad not ? declared tbntconciliation bad reached its limit The Church and tbe tenure of land wer «> he knew , very difficult subjects ; but was Government , therefore , to shrink from coping with them ? At all events there should have been some inquiry on the subject of the tenures . And aa to the Church , it was so monstrous an evil , tbat be regarded Mahomet as a merciful conqueror in comparison of those who had founded its establishment in Ireland , i . He would apply its whole reveuue to
purposes of reali utility for the IriBh people . The Government of Lord Grey had the will and the power to deal Lentiicial Jy with Ireland , and was in a course of such dealing—and who had interrupted it ? Those who Beceded from that Government—Lord Stanley and Sir J . Grabntn . They who told us there was to be no more conciliation were ; the real causes of the excitement in which Mr . O'Connell was so active . He would not conclude without expressing bis conviction tbat tbe downfal of this empire would date from the day which should sever the kingdoms of Great Britain and Ireland ; but be could not , therefore , consent to concur in a system of coercion . .
Mr Milnes said tbat tbe great error of this and of all former Governments had been that .. they had neglected tbe feelings of the Irish Catholics , who were a people essentially religious . He must own , indeed , that he could not see what real grievance tbat people now sustained ; certainly they would gain nothing from tithe abolition , which , since tithe had been commuted into rent-charge , would be a mere transfer from the clergyman to the landlord ; but history showed tbat even imaginary grievances bad important consequences , and ought not to be disregarded . He theught this measure necessary ; and trusted that Ministers would continue to fulfil thtir pledge of impartial government .
Sir C . Napier made a somewhat angry attack on Lord Stanley , insisting particularly , and amid much laughter , upon tbe necessity of good temper in debate . He censured the conduct of Government with reapect to Ireland , and bestowed an equal reprobation upon Mr . O ' Connell . For Shis own part , be did not wish to see the Irish Church destroyed ; but he wished to see it reduced to the real wants of the country j not , however , with any view of suffering the rent charge to sink into tbe income of the landlords . Mr . SaCKviliIje Lane Fox entered into the question of the IriBh Church iu reference to the Roman Catholic Relief Bill , which he regarded as a very injurious measure ; and he quoted many texts of Scripture as authorities for bis opinions . ¦
Mr . M . J . OConnell commented on Sir J . Graham '? speech ; which , however , as well as the other speeches on the subject of agitation in general , appeared to him irrelevant in a debater upon an Arms BiU . He then examined , and found fault with , some of the details of the bill . Mr . Muniz justified aeitation in general , having himself , at tbe time ! of tbe Reform Bill , been an extensive agitator . Be * hd bis coadjutors had then been encouraged by Sir J . Graham , and no harm , bad come of it , and no barm had been meant by it Why then it was fit to leave the same latitude to the Irish . Still , however , if the great question of the stomach were right , he believed Mr . O'Connell ' s agitation would h& all in vain . He wished the Government would resort to conciliation instead jof coercion . The House then divided on the motion tbat tbe bill shosld be referred to a select committee .
For the motion ... 122 Againstit . i ... 276 1 Majority for tbe bill 145 The Empire ; and the South America steamers , says a New York paper , in thcii- ascending trip ou tbe 23 rd , ran one hundred miles in four hours and ahali . The qutstiion is yet undecided which boat has the greatest speed .
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i j ' HARMONY HALL . LETTER XT / . TO THE EDITOR OF THE NORTHERN STAR . In my last letter I stated my intention of reverting at length to some points of Mr . ( Owen ' s preliminary Charter * and showing their relative importance when compared with other objects of agitation , which now engage the public mind ; but previous to doing this , I think it desirable to inquire what ; axe really the chief wants of man . j That question , calmly and seriously put by any reflecting mind , may be easily answered , and will show what are , in reality , the most valuable kinds of wealth . | We shall find tbe chief requisites are air , water , food , clothes , shelter , Instruction , amusement , the affections of those with whom we associate , and good society ; and if these could at ailjtimes be procured in abundance , then would men have all tbe materials that could be desired to insure their health and happiness . !
If we proceed to inquire , in the next place , whether the means exist to supply man with all the kinds of wealth thus shown tojbe requisite for bis health and happiness ? we shall find tbat they do exist most abundantly , with one single exception . The means required besides air Which all can obtain of some description or other , J without purchase , ) are land , water , labour , skill , and capital . These exist in great superfluity , ] not only for tbe supply of the present population of the world , but also for its unrestrained increase for many aaea . All that
is required is tbe knowledge bow to apply the materials to procure these results , ' and maintain them through succeeding ages . If -we further sak the question—how ig it that these results have not been attained , and tbe well-being and happiness of the human race have not hitherto been secured ? there can be but one reply , namely , that we have hitherto been too ignorant to understand our own interesta , and to be so united an to apply [ the abundant means around us in a manner that shall secure our happiness . J
To produce at all times the greatest amount of the most valuable wealth in the shortest time , and with the greatest pleasure and benefit ] to the producers and consumers , it ib necessary that upon a certain proportion of land there should be united labour , skill , capital and population ; and that these materials should be combined and directed by those whoj understand the three great principles , or fundamental truths on which I have proposed to base tbe seciety to be formed , namely , that man does not form his own character , but that it is formed of bis eriginal organization , and of tbe circumstances that surround him in every period of hia
existence ; that be has not tbe power to believe or disbelieve except in accordance with tbe impressions that are made upon hie mind ; and that hejhas not the power to love or bate except in accordance with the feelings created within him by any object Such persons would alone be enabled to unite in ! their due proportions tbe materials for the production of wealth . Let us look at the present state of . society , as it regards the whole business of life ; and what can be conceived more absurd or irrational than is there presented to our view ? j With land sufficientif cultivated
, even moderately , to supply one hundred millions of people , we l * . ave in this kingdom , with a population of about thirty millions , the greatest outcry made to alldiw us to import corn from other countries , under the . supposition that if this be not done we must starve ! whilst our own fields present a mean , beggarly , and pitiful appearance , solely because we do not apply to themj that healthy exercise and skill which is capable beyond all other things of giving pleasure and enjoyment , b ' oth physical , mental , and moral , to all who can take part in the performance of the labour . 1
Wtth millions of our people unemployed , or ill employed , we keep them in idleness , daily and hourly contracting vicious , degrading , and disgusting habits , destructive of all their powers of body and mind , and rendering them the scourge and dread of those who consider themselves their superiors ; [ whilst these Buperiers might , by rightly training and exercising tbeirown faculties , and directing those of the parties who are now thus unfortunately placed , receive advantag » s of a far higher nature than any that have hitherto been placed within their reach . I
With plenty of well skilled and highly talented individuals in every department of science , who are unable to obtain beneficial exercise for their skill ; and those who are employed being chit fly jer solely so , in minor , trifling , petty matters , such as are utterly unworthy of the present age , we suffer most grievously from the want of important measures being carried out ; measures that would provide in the moat liberal manner for the food , clothes , shelter , instruction , and rational amusement for every individual , and thereby prepare him to form a part of that good society which ! will tend above all things to gratify the feelings and desires of all , and lead them forward with increased vigour to the pursuit of more extended and enlarged happiness .
With a machine-power twenty-foJd larger than our population , and capable of extension in any proportion that may be required , we suffer pur people to be naked or Ul-clothed ; v ? e still permit man to perform heavy , laborious toil and exertioa , more severe than that to which the inferior c ; iminals are doomed ; and we daily and hourlv depress the means of ( procuring the common necessaries of life , until , if we proceed much longer at the same pace , -we shall be overwhelmed by such an amount of vice , crime , and misery , as the mind of man has not hitherto conceived .
With capital so abundant that it can procure scarcely any remuneration for its employment ; with between eleven and twelve millions of specie lying idle in the Bank of England ; and with a restriction of tho circulating medium utterly incapable of representing the amount of wealth that is created ; wo allow Ltnd , labour , skill , and machinery all to stand separate , disunited , and unproductive , th « reby entailing an amount of misery upon our children and our country , which , when we shall have acquired the knowledge I speak of , it will appear to us almost an impossibility that we should ever have allowed to exist whilst the means of preventing it lay so immediately within our teach .
I am glad to see by the letter jof your correspondent " Gracchus , " inserted iu this day ' s paper , that our Chartist friends are likely to btcome fairly roused to tbe importance of a National Society . Let us proceed fairly and promptly with this subject ; and we may speedily acquire a strength capable of demonstrating to our rulers the ease with which every requisite fur human happiness , may speedily be placed within tbe reach of all . We ueed not longer to quarrel and contend about who shall possess this © r that power . The power of
doing good , of providing well for ourselves , our families , and every individual of our species , is now within our reach , and let us ] lose no opportunity of embracing it . Let that spirit of unity -which can alone lead to successful results be seen a * nong us . Let us find out the persons that are jmost advanced in the sciences of human nature and ef society , tbat they may direct our united energies in the best manner for the benefit of all . Let us bring into uee all the appliance which the ingenuity and invention of man haa brought so liberally to oar aid , and we shall soon be enabled to
produce such a change in the appearance of society as shall astonish and delight all wblo behold it The crisis which is now rapidly progressing , aa is most evident in every department of society , requires that we act most promptly on some well defined principles , capable ot universal ( application , that they shall immediately be embraced by all . Let r . ny rational man look at tha feelings now being called out by tbe agitation of the various remedies that are proposed , and then say whether be can expect love , peace , truth , or charity , to emanate from such ! sources . If we look at the Repeal qm-stion , the debate now going forward is likely to exoite and irritate to such an extent that until true principles jshall be placed before them , must of necessity goad the different parties onwards to such measures as shall , ] if carried far e ough , produce consequences at which the human mind shudders to contemplate . f
The education clauses of ths Factory Bill have besn obliged to be given up , on account of their want of universality ; the parties on both sides wishing to coerce the mind to believe certain matters , -without waiting for evidence being brought to insure conviction . I The repeal of the Corn Laws is sought for on the most partial and imperfect grounds , and in a spirit calculated to aronaet tbe most angry fee ' . ingB , and to injure the personal Interests of our fellowmen ; instead of beins ? placed on tbe legitimate basis of our having free trade in all things with all tbe -world .
The advocacy of the People ' s Charter ha 3 hitherto been conducted in a . spirit the reverse of what I hope soon to see manifes ed . The numbers of its advocates , and of the Repealers in Ireland , are quite sufficient , as soon as the spirit of unity shall be well developed in both , and they shall proclaim themselves the advocates of universal measures beneficial to every individual , to produce a public opinion that shall urge upon the Government the necessity for a ptaci ful change , in a manner tbat they will be unable to resist .
Let this public opinion be once secured , and the whole of the practical steps necessary to produce en immediate change , as it were by magic , are ready to be developed . Contention and strife , persecution and auger , may be immediately and ] for ever banished from among men ; andevuryone may enjoy oU that is truly essential for his well-being , physically , mentally , or morally . ¦ I am , Sir , Your obedient servant , William Galpim . Harmony Hall , Hants , June 17 , 1843 .
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THE NATIONAL BENEFIT SOCIETY . ITS FOUNPATION , PRIHC 1 PLE . TO THE CHARTIST PUBLIC . Brothers , — Mr . Galpin bath readily , and I may add , generously , ( seeing that it is not usual with disputants te make admissions in favour of their opponents , ) admitted , that under . exciting circumstances his proposition will be open to all the objections which I make in the election of the central or local presidents ; and relies upon the impression tbat his three fundamental truths are capable of making upon every individual mind for speedy success . ( See letter thirteen , paragraph nine . ) In tbe latter part of the fourth paragraph he says , " My dependence is not upon any person who may ba selected to preside over the society , but on the truth of the principles on which it is to be based , and on the daily increasing knowledge that will be gained of the science of human nature and of society . "
I must here remind you , Brothers , that the objection referred to above , whbteunto tb . 9 foregoing is a set off , amounted to this ; lhat if , as Mr . Q . set forth , the people were incapable of electing a council for the society , they were equally incapable of electing a president for tbe society . This position I conceive- to be unalterable by any circumstances . It ia self-evident that , if the first objection is valid , the second , of necessity , must be equally valid ; and , following the same comprehensive and easy mode of reasoning , if tbe impression of the truths whereof ho writes , and the increasing knowledge of ( he sciences of human nature and society , ore capable of rendering the people fit to elect the first presidents and all the local presidents , they -will surely make ihem fit to elect the
central council , and the local councils to act with , and counsel , the said presidents . For what do we need a council ? Is it to serve us or the president ? If it is to serve the body , bow absurd to give tbe president power to choose them , and Oisoiiss them &t bis pleasure . ' When we appoint a council , is it not under the impression that their collective wisdom will b « better than the wisdom of one man ? Are they not appointed to take counsel together and decide on that course they deem best to perform the work we require to be done ? If there was any one member of a council that bad all the knowledge and ability that ia requisite to do tbo work l . imBelf , even then the . propriety of your giving him the power to rto us he liked would be questionable ; and if a president is
allowed to appoint , his councillors and dismiss them at will , it is virtually giving him the power to act as he pleases , -wjifhout having any guarantee that be posseesea sufficient lability and integrity , Again , if the Presisident is to be thought so superior to the council as only to listen to their opinions and ace with or without them , what need of going to tho expense of supporting a council for him 1 because he could collect together any of the members that lived near him and have tbeir advice , and afterwards * if be felt icclified , tell them their advice was not good . He need not approve of it , and might not act npon it ; and thus'dismiss them , without insulting them with tbe empty name of a council . Indeed , this council without tbe power to act , being without a veto , reminds niu of that act of the National
Assembly of France which divided the people by a sort of negativelaffiraiaUve , into citizans active and inactive ; thereby disfranchising the great majority of the French nation , after they had declared all the male adults frea and equally citizens of France . Bat are there not duties for a council to perform other than merely giving their opinions , Or deliberating ? Should they not take cognizance of tbe acts of the secretary , treasurer ,- and president ; . and see that each of them do their duty te tbe society ? Should they not be watchers of the honesty of each ? checks against any inclination of either to defraud tbe body or act iu any way dishonouj able- ? Should not they have the power to sae the book , bonds , check * , aud papers of every description peitaining te the association , that defalcations ma ; be
checked ere thoy become ruinous ? In the societies , whether political or trade , to which I have belonged , such have been the duties and powers of tho committees or . ceunciJs , where there was money to nny considerable amount . There were stewards oa the committee ; and the cash was placed in a box with three , four , or five locks , one for each officer , so that the money should not be taken eut without the whole were present . -But if the council bold their office at the will of the president , how can they perform these important duties ? I maintain that to discharge these duties fully , they must bold their office at tbe wi'l of the members , and be responsible to them for tbe strict fulfillment thereof . It is a queation how far a good system of eriusation and good circumstances from youth up would remove the liabilities of mankind
to errors and injustice . But , be thut as it may , whilst we live in old society , and are open to the taints of her faulty' institutions , we must be governed by our experience ; and therefore guard against all those faults of oar raco that have oecurred , and are continually occurring , and in all probability will continue to occur . Wherefore , however honest virtuous and wise we may think our fellow mi' : i , in placing them in offices of trust we must pises sufficient guards about them to prevent , if we can , the possibility of their doing oii-, bt dishonourable , and thereby preserve their characters unsullied , and our persons , aud properties unharmed . In support of the necessity of such mutual checks , I could cite numerous instan jes ; some where they have saved societies from ruin , and othei"s" r here the lack of it'baa produced ruin '; but for the present shall rest on the arguments I have adduced .
in reply to the third paragraph , I would say , that a Council' without a vote cannot be democratic ; and , in acknowledging the compliment to myself in the second paragraph , I must say I am happy to think that the spirit of my letter hath sivea friend Galpiu such pleasure , as I would ever wish to carry on any discussion , ia which I should engage , in a friendly , yet firm spirit ; and having found a similar spirit pervading my brother disputant ' s letters , I have felt like pleasure in the perusal thereof . With these remarks , I move en to letter 14 . In reply to the second paragraph , if this applies to who should fill tbo chief offices , I must assure Mr . G . he mistakes mo . I do not care who the persons are that
lead such n movement for the benefit of the people . It matters not to me whether tbey are sprigs of the court or the cabin ; peers , priests , patricians , or peasants ; nor of what sect . If they will sincerely and zealously , and industriously assist in such a work , tbey are of the people . I depend on tbe influence of the principles of truth and justice on tbe minds of men to tffest tbat unity of purpose and unity of action , tbat friend Galpin seeks to produce by vested power in the presidents of the association : and I hope yet to convert my honourable disputant to that faith in his own doctrine of circumstances and education , that he shall place hia whole reliance on their influences on our fellow men to produce that desired unity , and abandon his love of despotic authority .
Third—With regard to Mr . O'Connell , or any other leader giving explanation of hia conduct , I think it is pretty evident , tbat it should be done whenever required by those who have a right to know , and not be led blindfolded . Indeed , O'Connell hath recently given a strong proof of the necessity of leaders , explaining tbe motives of their actions . ( See his calumnious insulting refusal of Chartist aid . ) Fourth—With respect to the Chartist agitation of 1839 , I join my hopa with his . Bat a people eoaded
with wrongs , with increasing oppressions and starvation and death staring them in the face , will , however tame their disposition , sometimes become excited . I think that we did all tbat laid within our power by our speeches , &c , to show that the ehaiici we sought was for the benefit of all . But influence . p itronage , prajudice , and ignorance made the middle aud upper classes deaf to our appeals for political rights and common justice . Poverty , however , with its fearful strides , is breaking down those bBrriers to their feelings ; and there appears some hope for their conversion .
Fifth—To stick a thorn in the sides of any Govommeat , or of any individual of our fellownien , ia no wish or purpose of Mr . Galpin ' s . There is a principle in that ; but it is different " to the law of the woods , as Hawkeye said to David Gammut No it is not the law of the Wilderness ; and we li ^ e in a mental Wilderness , and shall find ouraulves obliged to act accordingly . Neither is it the law of the Socialists ; for are not tbty a thorn in the sides of the priesthood ? Aye , aa surely as the Christians were a thorn in the sidts of the Pagan priesthood ; as ssrsly aa tha Protestants" were a thorn in tho Papal priesthood ; aa sura as the Dissevers were and are a thorn in the sides of the Church of Ed el and
priesthood : and the priesthood deal with them as an irritating thsm in tbeir Bides ; and if the Socialists succeed in drawing the people from the said priesthood , they will have served them as we did tha Whigs , —bring them their high placea to the earth . But th <* y will hot find this task so easy as was ours with that ruling faction . Tfiey will find their work is even now scarce bejrun . I Will not say they will ever do this ; but of one thing I feel confident , truth will ultimately prevail , be it on whichever side it may ; and longing for the age of truth . I remain , Yours in hope , Gracchus .
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A few weeks since , in au ancient chest bought at . au auction in Ipswich , waa found , in a hidden partition , a deed of the age of Elizabeth , connected with , apparently , a large estate in Kent , and some old coins . The chefet had been in . possession of the family from whom it had been purchased at the sale aa far as memory reaches , without knowledge ox ita hidden contents . ON Tdesdat a desperate caso of suicide occurred in the Infantry barracks . A private soldier named Marshall , who was acting as servant to one of the
officers , put ja period to his existence in a very cool and extraordinary manner . He had taken off his shoes and stockings and iaid himseif down on his back ; he thea put tho muzzla of his musket into his mouth , and puMed the trigger with his too . It is supposed the gun w ? . i charged with more than one bail cartridge , as a window ia the room was shattered by tho concus-iou . It is needless to say that the poor man died instantly . No cause can . be assigned for this dnautul act . A very short time previous to its o . nm'nission ne seemed in his usual good spirits , —Glasgow Chronicle ,
3eau≫Mal ^Arjfament
3 Eau > mal ^ arJfament
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Negro Flying . —Tho editor of the Boston Mail ridicules Mr . Henson and his aerial steam-carriage , and predicts that tha first career down the inclined plane will end somewhat like Sambo ' s first expert rnent , when he undertook to tly from a garret window with a pair- of win ^ s manufactured out of a leather apron . The honess n eno struck the grouud with his head hard enough to break a sledge-hammer ; and springing to his feet wit , h ] a kind of a rebound , scratched his woolly pate , exclaiming , " Dem ' s fuss rate flying ; no bird do him quicker ; but golly ! dey ' s dam hard lighting . ' " i
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Citation
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Northern Star (1837-1852), June 24, 1843, page 7, in the Nineteenth-Century Serials Edition (2008; 2018) ncse.ac.uk/periodicals/ns/issues/vm2-ncseproduct1218/page/7/
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