On this page
-
Text (1)
-
Untitled Article
Note: This text has been automatically extracted via Optical Character Recognition (OCR) software. The text has not been manually corrected and should not be relied on to be an accurate representation of the item.
-
-
Transcript
-
Note: This text has been automatically extracted via Optical Character Recognition (OCR) software. The text has not been manually corrected and should not be relied on to be an accurate representation of the item.
Additionally, when viewing full transcripts, extracted text may not be in the same order as the original document.
Untitled Article
/ Continued from our 3 Zz ! h pagej Bat it may have appeared ?—It may , Sir j I cannot jbj it did ~ aob . j . " he article towel * 1 call your attention Bays— "We jffotast in the most ardent m » an » againrt the conduct of the magistrates in compelBng t « to give evidence ^ sinst ths prispnera . * Do yon remember those irordi ? . —I do sot Serjeant mmm begged to intemrpt "Mr- Ham . jlr . Henn—I think I am entitled now to ask him -win fje swear that iMs-WBS not inserted in the paper -with fcl * KECtiOE ? Serjeant "Warren—He has already stated that he Jjas no recollection of having seen that document before , lad , therefore , yon have no right to read one xrardvl It " *
3 Ir . Justice Crampton—Certainly net 5 Ir . Henn—Yerywell . I sm entitled at all events to ask him this . Win yon swear you did not , -when Editor of the Patriot , pr&tert against reporters baing ex ; mined ? 2 said before I did not . I know yon did , bat answer bib again ?—I did not jaaie any roch protest—even in this sentence which I have Died—( Isngbterj . —I made no such protests Then yon did use the sentence ?—Ton mistake ase—2 Sid not . .
Uot » thel > onnybrook meeting was perfectly quiet and peaceable?—It was . " K \ is 5 t not so st the Clifden meeting ?—It was . VTzz it not so at Longhrea *—It was . ¦ Wa s it not so at Mullaghmast ?—It was . And at Clifden yon saw m 6 n coming on horses , with tfceir wives behind them ?—{ laughter } . —I did . Ard numbers of the cavalry withont any saddles or hridlrs ?—[ laughter )—Yes . Tsed large numbers to attend the meetings and the grrr . PTE ia the country ?—Tea , the dinners and meetings yere mamerouily attended . Answer me this question , Sir , if you please—Did yon at any of Ifcose mestinas see any of the traverse ** do sny 2 «» inconsistent with the duty of a peaceable cis zsa ?—Pa any act ?—Tea .
Was there any tendency to a breach of the peace at any oae of these meetings ?—Ho , there was not Ioj- Henn here dosed his cross-examination . 3 ? Jadge P < arin—Did not # end the report ef the D aBajbrook meeting to any newspaper ? 2 fo ; it was ¦ very lass at the time . CroEs-examiDed by Mr . Hatchell—Saw Mr . Bay at 2 Iull 22 hmast , on the scaffold , and spoke to him thtre ; cane direct from London in August , by railway ; took a strong interest in the Cumberland election of 1 S 37 ; knows Sir James Graham . Mr . HatcheD—Had you any communication with Sir James Gnbam in -June last ? The Attorney-General objected , and the Court ruled tisst ihe question could not be put ilr . Hatchell—Ton may go down . The Court adjourned to ten o ' clock tomorrow
morning . SIXTH DAT . SlTTGvG OT IBS CorST , SATITBDAT , JA 5 ITAST 20 . The Judges sat at ten o ' clock precisely , at which fctmr the traversera were in attendance . The jury having been called over , the e-ridencsfor the Crown was resumed . The first witness called was Mr . John Jackson , the Irish correspondent of the Morning Herald , who , haying been sworn , was examined by Mr . Brewster , Q . C ., sad deposed as follows : —I am connected with the press—nith the iondpn Honing Herald . I am the Irish correspondent of that paper , and was so in the course of last summer and autumn . I attended at the nestings of the Repeal Association . I was ia the habit of transmitting regularly to London by £ be post reports d what too 5 r place at those meetings .
Mi . Brewster—My Lords , 1 wish , to apprise you that it is not my intention to make this gentleman go over sfl the speeches which the Court has already heard . I will confine myself almost exclusively to asking him who took part at the meetings . Take these documents is yoor hand , Mr . Jackson , and see whether they are the original notes which yen sent to London ? Tea , ibeysre . 3 j this paper which I now hand yon your report of the meetings that was held on the 30 th of Hay last ?—Bis . I wish you to look to page three of that report—I Kelt . Do you see in these notes a report of a speech Esdi upon that occasion by Mr . O'ConneH ?—Yes , I do . Bead the first few lines .
The witness proceeded to read the report , which commenced by noticing the fact of ilr . CPConnell ' s tsTinj directed the attention of the Association to an estdt which appeared in the report of the proceedings of the Issgfcrd Bipe&l meeting , which had been pub-V * h = d is the TncmcaCs Journal of fee same data . In thit report he was made to Apply tie phrase * ' ruffian soldiery" to \~ ke army of Great Britain ; but he begged Ism to state that he never nsed any such expression . The dreamstanca to which he had aBn&ed in his lisseford speech had reference to the pathetic ballad of "Aileen Aroon . " He fidr . O'C ) then proceeded in "La rcsionisry strain to LLanghter . ) 33 t . Brewster—That will da
< Jo to pifc six now and read from that ; I believe ycra fesva not seen those manuscripts since you sent them to London ?—I only got them from Mr . Kemmia to initial . late that document , and refer to tbe meeting of Jem 6 , at the Association . I should observe , my lords , that this gentleman ' s ^ evidence applies only to £ s meeSaga of the Association at the Com Exchange , ed 3 nothing else . l < ook to page l , and see which of the traverserB were E *» that meeting '—Daniel O'Connell . look to p&ge 6 , and see if there wk any others o ? them there ?—Tes , tfcs Member for Kilkenny , Mi . John O"Ccnnell , Mr . Barrett , of the Pilot , and Mr . Siaele .
[ The examination of this witness lasted nearly the trhole fiay ; but was tetj nninteresting . His examination was mainly confined to the identification of the irsversera , as having been present , and taking part , in the several meetings of the Association set forth in the BSl of Indictment and tbe Bill ef Particulars ; and in tie handing in , and reading , of Beveral documents vhkh he had procured from the officers of the Associa-Eca . When the direct examination closed , the witness ¦ r » r Cross ^ xamined by Mr . Ktesibbon—May I take the E > erty of asking you , Sir , whst cwt' -y "'^ you are ? laa i Ciare man . Ten are an Irishman Bt all events ?—Tes , I am . Eott Ion * have yon been a reporter?—I have been l : r t ** D yeirs in the capacity of Irish correspondent to & £ Ifo'xing Herald .
I dii no- ask you , Mr . Jackson , how long yen had fea » correspondent That was not my qnestien ; ¦* isi 1 asied you was how long yon bad been a reporter ?—I cant say I am a reporter ; that is to say , I £ 2 act a shorthand writer . I Hi aot ask yon were you a shorthand writer .- I * & = £ tou how long you had been a reporter ; do you E » sa to say you are not , and never " were a reporter ?—I ta = oi a reporter , and never was in that sense of the ¦ Vord . la what sense © f the word ?—I mean in the sense of d a short-hand writer , for the term , " repor ter , " is IKSD 7 applied to a shorthand -srritsr . Tnen , by-a " rei > orter"yon mean a shorthand writer , OKeaograpber ?—Tes , I da
y ? Bte you ever in the habit of reporting proceedings t- _ 25 « etings or courts for tbe purpose of such reports 1 st ? pablisfcod in the newspapers ?—Tea , after a mante- ( laagb % er > . Then you Were , in point of fact , 3 reporter of public psfctsdines , with a view to having them published in £ * Bewpapers ?—Tes . That is just what I mean . When did you begin k > Fractiee in that rapacity ?—Three or four years ago . With what newspaper did yon begin ?—I had been a 2 a b ^ bit of centnbntinz to provincial papers before 1 » is connected with the Herald . By reports I do not mean contributions ; bnt to what FJoTintial papers used you to send your reports?—ftadp ally to tbe Limerick Star and the LtTnerUSi tt- 'MrfcSL
TOa t were tbe politics of the Limerick Star ?—It was 1 liberal paper . . Aad 89 , too , is the Limerick Chronicle 1—No , it is not ; SaCsQserrative . Did yon . send reparts to both of these journals at the fcsg time ?—Hio , Ididnot ; I used to sent reports from ^ 7 own place , and not from Limerick . And of all this wide craation , Mr . Jackson , pray ¦ ist place belcaga you ?—( laughter)—Kilruih . Ibat is your place ?—Tes , it is n » y native place ; my 'sSbutions had ae reference to politics . I did Dot " ask you anything about politics , Sir ; your l 5 Psrta hid reference to public proceedings , lad they **—had they notreffcrence to matters of public interest ? ^ -Tb ej -jrere principally sketches of the pstty sessions S l&ush .
- ^ Siafcated sketches?—A little emfcellMied occata aily . ^? being «« a little embellished" do yon mean to con"ty that there were pictures in them for the purpose of Jgeliuhnient ?—Ko ; they were pen and ini embelnesgrfj , Jp * ai , I suppose , that by embellishments you mean r ^ - ^ toR in the report which , in poM of fact , did not * gj-Deciaedly . P ^ sthisg , in fact , that was not true ?—Tea-5 *^ 7 So fhs length of saying , I * nppcse , that half of t
*» » sre actjons ?—There were many flcfeozs ju my li ^ f 3 stl ^ sopposej i * "what you call reporting after ^« ?—Tts , precisely so—{ langhter ) . w ? T cenmenced yonr career as a reporter by ^? felEehocda ?— No , not exactly that ; I wrote on v ^ as princ iple , and in the E £ = ie Btyle , as a conlribnj £ » a * g ! £ ne . 1 jn ^ J en contnbnted to magazines ?—I haTe dene « o ^ T' ^ iTaagssane etScIes sre embfllhhed after the J ^^^ ion ?_ My lcapKtne Brtides were tale * of Whj ^* of ^ Poet ?—IaSeed a very large bit of a i ** % ftDe ! 8 " ^ e ^ a ^^ bly tall > . - •^ feSf * isti » called in tbe comity Clare a poetasther ? Wt ^ - ® - - Ton may , if you Ilk--, apf 1 j that appella-^ Mor 1 a © not mean to ay 1 tm a poet
Untitled Article
Have you contributed articles in verte to any pn bliacation ?—Yes , Iiave . Did you ever contribute to the Nation ?—Never . To what paper * -were you in the habit of Bendlnj ¦ verses ?—To the Limerick papers I have named . And your poetry , I am to suppose , bore some conformity to the principles of the paper to which you ent ii ?—In nine cares out of ten such was not tbe fact But yon . admit that ia the tenth case it might , perhaps , b « the fact ?—It might , perhaps . Were the reports you sent to tbe newspapers similar to youx contributions to the magazines ?—No , they were not To what magazines de yon contribute?—There was a sketch of mine some time since in th « University Magasine . It was a tale of fiction .
Tes , but was it not intended to pare for true ?—Tes , with those who would be fools enough to believe it true —( loud laughter ) . Was it not intended by those reports to convey an accurate account of what passed at the Kilrusb Pstty Sessions ?^ Some of what was published did occor there . Tou intended they shonld all appear in tbe newspapers as ttne ?—Tes . And yet they were not true?—Some of them were When did yon cease reporting at Kflrush ?—TMb month two years I came np here . How did you propose to live in Dublin I—I | fot & letter from the proprietors of the Morning Herald , asking me to come up here as tbeir Irish correspondent
Dnbhn is a place where a man must have a little income to make himself smooth . Pray bow do you support yourself ?—I have one hundred and fifty guineas a-year from the Morning Herald as their correspondent A fixed salary ?—Tes . Whatwtrayou to do for that?—To send a letter every day , hiving reference to the leading topics of political interest , and whatever the local papers adverted * to . That is , you were daily to read the morning papers in Dublin , and to make a summary of that which you thonjrht would be agreeable to the Morning Herald editor?—Tea . Would you ba good enough to take up the first of those papers produced , that of the 30 th of Wny . Did I understand you to say this was the note you sent to the Meriting Herald ?—That was my daily letter .
Now , mind , I dont ask you about the subject of what is written in those scraps of paper , but I ask yon are those the Identical scraps of paper you forwarded to the Morning Herald ?—The very identical papers . Now show them to me . ( Witness handed them t » the Counsel : the manuscript was written en both sides ef tiie sheet ) Did yon send these identical papers for the pnrpose of being Bet up In the office of the Morning Herald *—I did . When didy on begin to attend the Associationmeetings ?—About eight or nine months ago . Were the accounts of the proceedings you sent over froHi your own notes ?—Sometimes they were , and sometimes borrowed from the notes of the man near me , perhaps . Were they borrowed from the notes of tbe man near yon ?—Yery frequently they were ; I copied them from the slips of the man next me .
Was that a * hort-band writer '—Sometimes he was , and sometimes not ; I gave the substance of what hi had written out , of course . I could not copy short-hand notes , not beiDg a short-hand writer myself . Used you ever to Tary the language when yon copied from the manuscript of the man next you ?—I used In order that it should not have the appearance of being a copy of what he transcribed ? Precisely . —And those are the notes you have beenreading here to-day ? Tea . — Look to those notes yon have read , and select out of them any one piece of paper which yon will swear , upon solemn oath , contains what was taken down by yon from the lips of tbe man represented in it to bare spoken ? Upon my solemn oath this paper ( holding up one of his sheets of manuscript ) contains the substance
of what 2 &x . O'Connell said . —Will yon swear those ¦ were bis words ? To tiie best of my belief it is the substanca of what be said ; I never attttsmpted to gite his exact words . —Sow , attend to me . On your oath , tfi « you write what ia upon that slip of paper while Mr . CTConnell was speaking ? Tea . — Upon your oath , was that written down upon that pisce of paper from the lips of O'Connell while he was speaking it ? Tes , occasionally taking a note , and catching the leading topics in his discourse . —I ask you to fix upon any one of the pieces of paper you bava in your hand , that you w 5 ; positively swear that you believs was written m . e tbe speaker was speaking » To tbe best of my recollection this ( meaning one of his slips ) was , bnt I cannot be positive . —Then you are not
positive 1 No . —What is the date of that slip ? The 30 th of May . —Then you are not positive as to that ? Not very . —Are you positive at all that that piece of paper was written from his lips while he was speaking ? It is in substance what he said , to the best of my recollection . —Is that an answer ? I think it is . —On your oath was it written while he waa speaking , and not from a paper ? I cannot swear that , certainly . —Then yon won't swear that it may have beeu taken from a paper ? A certain portion of it may or may boLMight not any person in the Court give me that answer—that " portions of it may or may not ? " Must it no * b ° either of tbe two thinjr * ? I do not recollect any particular ease . —Ceuld you fix upon any one of all the slips ? I conld not—Take up your paper of tbe
5 th of July . Was that little bundle made up in the same way as the others ? Tes . —Was it written whilst you were in tbe Association ? It was . —Was it written whilst tbe people were speaking ? Tes . — Da yon swear that ? 1 da—The whole of it ? Yes . While the meeting was going on , and in the Association , room ? Every one that refers to the meeting of the day was written in the room . —And while each particnlar speaker was speaking ? It was . —Do you swear that positively ; that every one of those slips were written in the Association , and while each speaker , whose language they purport to give , was speaking . Certainly not—Did you tell me a moment ago they were ? I did not . —Did yon tell me in any sense they were ? I said they were . ( Sensation . )—And you say
now they were not ? While the money was handing in I wrot * onfc what previously occurred . —Will you now turn to the spet * b put into the mouth ef Mr . O'Connell , on-the 15 thjof July ? He said he wished to call attention to two letters he bad received that morning from Sligo . One was written by a discharged soldier , stating " * he was employed by Mr . O'ConnelL "—Well now , have you the speech of Mr . O'Connell in moving the insertion in the American book of & letter received from America ? I h&va •• Mr . O'Connell moved that the letter be inserted in the American book , and not en the regular minutes , and that thanks be conveyed to
tbe two office-bearers named in tbe letter , as subscribed to their fund . *'—Do yon swear that sentence was written by yourself , when the speaker was speaking ? In my opinion it was . — "Was it not ? I can't be certain . Now , listen to me while I read from this paper ( "Freeman ' s Journal ) a Teport of the ssme speech you have been reading to ub— " Mr . O'Connell said it waa better to take up each of th 9 Americas letters by itself , and therefore moved that the letter should be inserted in the American book , but not on tfce regular mintites of the Association , and that ths thanks of tbe Association hs conveyed through the two office-bearers tbat "srere Earned in the letter to the subscribers to that
load . " Now , 1 a not toat verbatim with what you have read from y out slips ? Mr . BrewsUr—I beg your pardon , and I will take the opinion of the Court whether I am right er cot I have no objection if ilr . Fitz ^ ibbon puts this newspaper in evidence , but 1 object to his reading any quantity cut of a newspaper he pleases , and then asking the witness—Does that correspond with something be has in his hands ? Mr . Fitzsibbon—I am not at present asking Mr . Bre-jrst&r to look at what I am doing zt all—daughter ) . I aia at present testing tbe credit of thia -witness ; and I contend for my right to show tbe jury that by any human means I cannot , without having that paper before 107 eyes , repeat one "word or syllable tbat is ia that paper . -
Mj . Brewster—It ia not to the newspaper I object , but t » tbe mode of examination adopted by Mr . F : tzgibbon . I otgect to tbe mode of his f-xamination , because xie reads from & newspaper the exact words of the witness ' s notes which he sent over in his corresponded ce . Mr . Filzgibbon—I dont read from the paper at all . I'll read from sy brief now , 1 tell you—( laughter ) . Mi . BrewBt € r—If yon offer tbe newspaper in evidence 1 will not object to it , and then you may examine him as to it . Mr . Filz ? ibbon—Here is my brief ; will yen bare it in evidence ? iGreat laughter . ) Mr . BrewBter—It is not competent for you to read from your " brief or any other document , and then ask tbe witness if what is read agrees -with cores be has taken . I ssy , it is not competent to Uo so , unless yon put tbe document in evidence .
jIi . FiUiribbon—I will take up tbis paper , &i ; d see if I don't read a report of every ¦ srorti the witness says be sent to the paper . Mi . Bre-R-ster—But that is what I olject to . Jadee Burton—Why go on to prove what you bave such » perfect transcript of ? Mr . Fr . zgibbon—Tbe course I am taking is infinitely mere fair to the witness than the course alluded to on the other side ; it Is the only fair ana legal course which I am at present adopting ; if I did not take this course , I would be stopped from leading the docamest , if I did iot examine thB witness aa to tbe fact , before he left tbe-table . Ie the paper of the next morning . I find a verbatim report of what the witness says he sent
to London , and if I did not ask him about tbat I would have been stopped from reading it , unless I asked the m-rn about it when I had him on the table . Here is a man "who comes on tbe table to tell the jury that he is a reporter for -a newspaper , ? ad ss tuch atended the lEEeticss of the AEs-cci&tion ,-Rbfcio Mi . O'Connfcll spoke . 1 will stiow he ib not a reporter , and tbat he was incapibie of "taking reports wheie he says he did , and that nisi hs £ E 5 trts is false . I want to sho w what he says is rtschitfely , and idtrally fzl « -, 2 nd s fabrication from fc ^ -u . nii'g to end , and that he is now speaking to the jnr . T f- ' E ai 33 fake , when he teils them tbit tha docu-&e : ta which he holds iii kis hand ttfcre written by him a : * . ii = n-fcciings . He comes here falsely reprticUtiDS t tLe in : ? that fact . Be did not take a note at those
Untitled Article
meetings , nor had fee the ability of taking notes , and , therefore , I want to show that what he did « eo was copied verbatim from the morning papers of the next day , and sent eff by him , although he tella the jury be wrote the pieces of paper at the meetings . Judge Bui ton—I seeyout object very clear . Judge Crampton—Mr . Fiiz ^ ibbon , am I to understand that yon intend to give the paper in evidence ? Mr . Fitzgibbon—No , I do not Judge Crampton—Then I feel great difficulty In that case in allowing this sort of examination , Mr . Brewster— If he puts in the newspaper n evidence I will withdraw my objection , but unless he does so I must press it . Mr . FiVzjibbon may tell me he will not read from the paper : but from his brief , and I object to that also , for how am I to know but that brief might be a copy of what this gentleman sent to the Morning Herald— ( Ianshter . ) Let him put In the newspaper as evidence , and I will withdraw the objection .
Mr . Fitzgibbon—I am here at present to , but no , I will get it In another form . Come , Sir , turn round and answer me . Tes , I wilL Mr . Fitzsibbon . —Will you now . Sir , tnke on yourself to swear , on your solemn oath , that you did not copy these slips of paper from the morning paper of the next day , and than send them offaa your own report ? To tha best of my recollection—I cannot say . I might have copied them either from the paper , or a notetaker ' s slips . —Hah ! hah ! Take tbat down . 1 will repeat the question , Sir , ( question repeated ) ?—I might have copied them either from tbe paper , or another notetaker ' s slips . —Well , did you do that while J . O'Connell wasspeaking ? I can't say that-One way or other ? No one way or other . —Did you . do
that on the same day of the meetings or the day after ? I cant be positive as to tbat—Not positive ? No , not positive . —Did yon Bee the report in the morning papers of tke next day ? I might have seen it —Then , you might have copied your report from the papers ? Some of it I might bave copied . —Tou might have copied it all ; eh ? It ia possible . —Did you ever copy from the morning papers at all ? Tes , I nsed to copy some , and cut out more from it . I sent the slips which I cut from the papers » ver whenever I adopted them . —And yon sent them to London ? I did , poBslbly . —On your solemn oath will you venture to swear you did not take all these papers from the newspapers , or from another note-taker's slips *
Judge Perrin—Come , Sir , speak up , and let us hear you , as it will save a great deal of time to do so . Witness—For all I can tell , I might have copied them from tbe newspaper or the note-taker ' s slips . Mr . Fitzgibben—Can you till from which you copied them ? I cannot tell which . A Juror—Mr . Jackson , did yon not swear , a while ago , that all yon wrote was done during the Vine of the meetings in the Exchange , and no place elsa ?—The majority of them were written there . Juror—0 , but you certainly swore they were all written there , and nowhere else . Chief Justice—Let Mr . Fitagibbon close his examination of the witness , and then , gentlemen , you can examine him .
Mr . Fitzgibbon—I will repeat the question of the juror , and ask did you not swear awhile Ago that you wrote allfthose slips at tbe meeting , and in no other place ? To tha best of my recollection the majority of them were written there . —Were all of them written there ? Not all perhaps ; some of them were written after the meeting wrs over , some of them were written n * -xt day . Did you do any of them from the newspapem ? Soms of them . —I ask you again dlt ! you not swear that they were all written at tbe meeting ? The majority of them were written there , or , at least , genei&lljj § ipe&king they were . Mr . Whiteside having told ths witness that he might go down from tbe table . Mr . Jackson said he wisbed to make one or two observations In vindication of bis character . Mr . Fitzgibbon objected , because the witness , if be wished to explain , should have done so during his examination .
Mr . Jackson—I merely wont to make one observation , my Lords , to vindicate my character before the public Mr . Fitzgibbon—Tou shall not , Sir . Th 8 Chief Justice—Let me hear what you have to say witness . Mr . Jacksen—Those manuscript documents , my lordB , were given by the proprietors of tho Morning Herald to Mr . Kemmis , tbe Crown solicitor , and , so help me God , I never saw them , or knew be bad them , unti he produced me the letter of those gentlemen , stating they had furnished him with them and requiring me to Initial them . I considered it was due to my character before tbe world to make this plain explanation of tbe troth . The witness was then allowed to retire .
Mr . Moore ( having eummunicated with the Crov > ii counsel ) said , that as he hid applied to them , and they refnaed his application , he was obliged to make it to the Court , namely , that his client and the other traversers should be famished with one copy of the notes of the witnesses examined upon tbe previous day and Thursday , in order to conduct their defence . Those extracts were very long , * ud they ( tbe traversers ) would not have copies of them but by their being furnished ; so he hoped the Court would grunt his application , which he considered very reasonable . The Chief Justice said that he did not know that the Court had power to make such an order . Mr . Whiteside—We will pay tor them . Mr . Moors—I am sure even if the Court had not the power of making the order , that if there was any difficulty felt by the officers of the Crown , it would be removed if tbeir Lordships saw no objection to allow them to be furnished .
Judse Crampton—If yon had no means of having copies , it would be very reasonable psibips , but you have your shorthand writers . The Chief Justice . —What documents do you ask for ? Mr . Moore—Copies of tha documents read by tbe witnesses yesterday end tha day before . We will pay foT copies , and we conld not bave them transcribed from sho » thnnd notes since the previous day . Mr . Fitzgibbon—They have read those documents in their c ? se . The witnesses read « very single word of them . They are here as documents . They are in the possession of the Crown aa documen t s .
The Attorney-General—Sneh a course never b * s been adopted until the present time , and I entirely object to it ; and I do so the more , because I cannot fail to recollect the conrse tbat was adopted towards ono of our witnesses . They have every meeting as to which they require documents repotted by their own Bhortbuudwriters for tbeir newspapers . They had the simplest and plainest course to adopt for ascertaining the documents which they now call for . I do not wish to state here some » aUera , but certainly under all the circumstances which hive * -. kenplaco with respect to one of onr witnesses , it will prevent me from departing irota the usual conrse , end I shall not give copies of the documents . Mr . Moore , Queen ' s Counsel—I am bound to say tbat after what has been jnst Eaid by the Attorney-General-I niUBt not call on the Court to make any order on the subject
Mr . Fittzibbon—I now Bubmit to the Coott tbat the whole of the evidence given by Mr . Jaekson ought to be slrnck . out He wns produced here as a witness to tell tbe Jury what he had beard and seen done at meetings , and read notes which he Baid at first were taken in a particular way at particular meetings . I submit that from his own shewing it ia as clear as possible tbat the whole of his evidence out-ht to be struck out . The Chief Justice—Don't you think this is not the occasion for making this application ? Mr . Fitz ^ ibbon—I rather think I am pst in time . It is when a witness Roes off the table that such an application micht to be made . Tbe Chief Justice—He has been cross-examined hy three gentlemen . I don't think tbe Court can accede to tbe . proposition that you make . It may be very well df-serving of consideration at Bnother period , but n « t now .
John Browne examined by Mr . Holraes^—I reside in Xf . Esan-stxtet , and carry on the printing and stationary Lusint--b . 1 have been long currying en the business . I ki-ow Mr . Ray . I bave known him for several years I have heard of an Association in the city of Dublin called the Loyal National Repeal Association of Ireland . Mr . Ray holds the situation of Secretary to that Society . I was employed to do some printing work for that Society . Tbe Association generally , through Mr . Ray , employed me , I bavet ^ en four or Sve > eara doing work for the Society . 1 bave been paid fox the work I have done , except a running account now . I was paid by Mr . Kay , and sometimes by a clerk in bis office . Have yon received much money from time to time for the business you did ?—I have . Could you mention how much ? Be under the sum . Mr . Whiteside objected te the question . He did not Bee how this could be evidence rgainst vhe traversers . Mr . Holmes—I will ask my own questions .
Mr . Whiteside—Of course you will , and I will object where I see fit Mr . Holmts ( to wltDess )—I now csk you to state , what amount yon received from time to time ?—I could not say . Ob , be under : have you kept any accountbook?—I have . The account was sometimes about £ 20 , and—Mr . Whiteeide—I object to 8 Dy evidence ef the contents of the gentleman ' s books , because they ought to have them here . Mr . Holmes ( to witness )—Have you not been served with » duces tecum ?—I have . Mr . Holmes—Well , now we will gratify Mr . White » side by getting it read from your books . Do you know what amount you received from Mr . Ray from time to time for printing ? Mr . Justice Perrin—Within what period ! Mr . Holmes—Within tbe last two yeaTS .
Mr . Whiteside—I am obliged to your Lordship for putting me in mind of tbat . I submit this is sot evidence ; the first thing in this indictment is stated to be on the 1 st of March . Mr . Justice Crampton—I don't see , for my own part , the relfevancy of the inquiry . Mr . Holme 3 thandiDg a document to the witness)—Did jcu print tbat document?—I did , and for the Repeal Association . I printed it in the year 1843 . Tbe Deputy Cierk of the Crown read the document , wfcich was the plan for the renewal of the Irish Parliament He also read documents , h « aded— " Instructions for the appointment of Repeal-wardens and collectors , " and ' Form for tbe appointment of Repeal-¦ wardeiis , " and others , which be admitted haviDg printed fox lae Association .
Untitled Article
« ™ TIa " , f then e ^ ined *» to the printi ng of The Address of the Repeal Aasociation to thn tobabl £ ats of countries subject to the British Crown , " Koto to be observed by Arbitrators in districts , " Arbitration noticss , " and others , all of which he admitted he printed . He said—I printed 4 , 000 or 5 000 copies of the paper called O ' Caltaoan ' s Letter ; l . eoo or 2 . 000 of the noUcet / or the sitting of the Arbitration Courts ; 290 of the roles to fee observed by Arbitrators ; 2 , 0 » 0 or 3 , 000 of theaddresB of the Association to th « British public ; and about . 2 , 000 or 3 000 of the summonses for the Arbitration Courts . I printed all these for the Association , and I waa paid for doing so . I printed some of them from jmanascript , and others from extract * from newspapers . I was served with a subpoena to produce the manuscript . I searched for it , but I found
very little . I found the paper which I produce , headed Leinster for RepeaL" I printed a bill with the same heading , of which I printed about 2 , 000 for the Association , and I waa paid for it The newspapers , I believe , called the Mullaghmast meeting a " monster meeting . ' I printed documents in reference to other monster me « tlngB which took place about Dublin . I have none of those documents here . I think I printed some in reference to tho Donnybrook meeting . Tbe documents I bave with me I brought in consequence of a uubpee ™ I received desiring me to do so . —And all the documents that are here did you print for Association ? I think I did—Were you paid for them ? Tes . Cross-examined by Mr . Whiteaide-Did you print these eleven documents ? Tes—Did you print these three documents ( headed " To the people of Ireland , " * c . )?—Tes .
Mr . Holmes here rose to ask the witnesB a question . Mr . Whitesido—I object to your asking the question unless It arose fr « m anytbiDg which fell from me on the direct Mr . Holmes—I omitted to ask tbe witness a question . Mr . Whiteside—I object , then , to your asking it now . Mr . Holmes—It is the oDly legal objection you have made . ; The Learned Counsel then called upon the Clerk of the Crown to have the documents handed to the witness read seriatim . Mr . Whiteaide submitted that nons of the documents could be made use of against tbe trav « rsers . Mr . Holmes said every one of the traversers was a member ef the Association . The documents were printed for the Association . Tbe traverseTS attended meetings of that Association , some of whom made speeches there , and the documents were clearly evidence against them alL
Mr . Whitesido—They ate no evidene r i ' lat Mr . Duffy . Mr . Holmes—The documents are printed by the desire of tbe Secretary , one of the traversers being the Secretary , and were paid for by the Association . Mr . Whiteside—Aa to Mr . Duffy , the only distinct evidence against him is that given by tbe gentlemen who saw him one day at Calvert ' a Theatre . Tbe Chief Justice—I beg your pardon . Justice Crampttra—This is not the time to make tktse objections . The Chief Justice—It was proved that Mr . Duff / atteiidod meetings of the Association , und banded in subscriptions . Mr . Whiteside—The evidence given to-day is not worth a rush . The Solicitor-General . —That is a question for tbe Jury . ;
The Atterney-Geueral—This is not the time for a commentary on the evidence . We will , when tbe time comes , shew tbe clearest evidence against Mr . Duffy . : Tha Chief Justice—The Court are of opinion tbat the documents are properly read against all . Mr . Whiteside said he did not contend tbat it was not evidence against a traveraer for a witness to say that he got a certain document . rom him ; but there was uo such evidence in that instance , therefore be made tbe objection . Judge Burton—All the traveraers are members of the Assoaiation , and the publication is by tbe Association . The Deputy Clerk of the Crown then proceeded to read & number of documents , one of which was" Instructions for tbe appointment of Repeal Wardens . "
Mr . M'Donough then rose to object to the reading of the documents as against his client ; and proceeded te read the several matters enumerated in tbe bill of partioulars , to show the Widu range of evidence selected by the Crown , and he contended that if these books were not included , it was quite plain that they ought to be now , on every principle of justice , excluded . To show that the Crown could not be allowed to wander out of the bill of particulars furnished , be referred to the case of " the King against Hamilton , " 7 Cau'ington and Payne , page 453 . In that cane tbe prosecutors added to the end of the bill . of particu l ars furnished by them
a notice ttmt tbat they intended to produce further evidence not therein specified , and Mr . Justice Littledale said that it would be tor tbe Judge at the trials to decide whether that further evidence , which waa not included in the bill of particulars , should ba received . In the present case , do such notice as that referred to was attached to the bill of particulars , which wrs most minute and ample in its details . He submitted that the point should be decitim '—not in reference to the magnitude of the present trial , but according to the general principle of law ; and , confident tbat . that was in bis favour , be objected , on tbe part ef Mr . Barrett , to the reception of the books in evidence .
The Chief Justice—When was the bill of particulars furnished . Mr . M'Djnonijb—On the 13 tb of November , 1843 . Tbe Attorney-General concurred in tbe observation of Mr . M'Donouxh tbat there should , in the decision to be tn ; ide , be no distinction between tbis and any other cane . He denied tbat tho principle relied on by the opposite bide was admissible . They were not bound by any rule of law in cases of conspiracy to enumerate all the evidence tbey intended to give . They were only bMjnd to specify tbe nature of the charge . That wa tbe principle established in all tbe recent decisions , upon this subject , as the Court would find by au ab stract of the cases bearing upon the point which their Lordships would find in Phillips upon Evidence , p . 4 * 2 ( the edition of 183 Sj . It cuuld not for a moment be conttmltd that the Crown was called upon to furnish in the bill of particulars the evideucfe upon which tho charge of conspiracy was to be based .
Judge Burton—Tho bill of particulars does not purport to give or to stato any of the evidence tbat might be adduced . The Attorney-General said not , and referred to a varist ? of authorities in support of hia position , and submittL-d thE . t tbe documents now proposed to be read in evidence , as shewing the general nature of tho conspir-cy with which the traversers were charged , should be admittsd . , Mr . Moore , Queen ' s Counsel , followed on tho same side vlth Mr . M"Donough . He said he was not aware tbat Mr . Browne ' s evidence went further than that at 6 omu time or other he printed those documents for tho Association , aud was paid for them by the Secretary . J udge Burton said , he thought the question to be argued was , whether these documents , as given in evidence , wcxe admissible , as not being contained iu the bill of particulars ?
Mr . Moore said , that wn the question for the Court to decide , but he wished to show , in the fivat instance , the nature of the evidence given . He would submit that , aa there waa nothing to show that these documents were adopted st any of tbe meetings at which tbe travelers were present , they did not cume within any of tbo three classes of evidence referred to by Mr . M 'Donougb . The Solicitor-General ,: in reply upon behalf of the Crown , said that , as he understood the Counsel on tbe
other side , there were two arguments put forward by them in support of the motion ; one of which was , that the evidence offered was not set out as an overt act iu the indictmsnt or bill of particulars , which it was the du ; y of the Crown to hays givi n , if they intended to prove it . Now , he ( the Solicitor General ) would say , that tmeb an argument was a misconception of the law upon tbe subject , for it would be a most extraordinary doctrine to lay down , that the Crown waa to furnish a prisoner or defendant with the byidencs to be brought forward against him .
Tbe Chief Justice pronounced bis opinion . He had been first greatly struck by the arguments of the traversers' counsel ; but , considering the nature of the charge against the travelers , he conceived that the Crown was not called upon to embody in tbe bill of particulars the precise evidence to be given ; tbe objection urged by the Learned Counsel for tbe traversers was , therefore , untenable , and the documents should be admitted . Judges Burton and Crampton concurred with tbe Learned Chief Justice ; and The Court ruled accordingly in favour of the Crown , The Court adjourned till ten o ' clock on Monday morning . SEVENTH DAY .
Sitting of the Codet . —Mokday , Jan . 22 . Mr . O'Connell arid the other traversers were early in Court this morning . Shortly after tbe Solicit 6 r-General and Serjeant Warren entered , tbe former shaking Mr . M'Doiiough very cordially by the hand . Mr . Kemmis , the Crown Solicitor , with his large morocco portfolio , tookhis seat under the bench ; while Mr , O'Connell , Mr . Fitzribbon , Q . C , and Mr . M'Donough , Q . C ., were conversing together , the Attorney-General came into Court , when he , the Solicitor-General , ond Mr . Serjeant Warren consulted together . At ten minutes past ten , tea of the jury took their places . In a few minutes after tbey were joined by the remaining two . In two minutes after tbe Lord Chief Justice , Mr . Justice Crampton , and Mr . Justice Perrin took their aeata on the beucb , when the Chief Justice rose and stated that tbeir brother Mr .
Justice Burton , was unavoidably absent , having caught a severe cold . The Attorney-General rose t > call attention ! to one of tbe documtnta read oh Saturday , but was interrupted by Lir . Hatchell , Q C , who stated to tha court tbat on the part of himself and tbe other counsel £ ot the traverses , they objected to the ttial going on in the absence of one of the Judges—namely , Judge Button . The Chief Justice intimated that h would take a note of the objection . The Attorney-Ganeral said that in tbo case of the Bristol riots a uimilai email ? bad taken place , but il
Untitled Article
wi dcuded by the Judges that the trial should proceed . Hs would then call attention to a document which waa given in evidence by Browne , the printer . He would enter it as already read—it waa a plan for the Irish Parliament . Mr . O'Conneil—A part was only read ; he looked upon it as aa important document , and tbat the whole should be read . The Attorney-General—Let it be read . It being banded to the Clerk iof the Crown , it waa read by him . iDuring iti perusal Mr . OConnell held a copy in hia b ° nd , and appeared to proceed page by page with the rea < ler ) . j The officer at the Court next read the document entitled " Plan for the renewed action of the Irish Parliament , " and also the rules for the government of the Arbitration Courts . "
The Lord Chief Justice inquired if there was any Other rule for the guidance of the Arbitration Courts I - . aides those { read , &ud the officer of the Conit answered in the negative . ' The Chief Justice—I was ' alluding to a rule which I am pretty sure waa read in Court , which went to this—that if either of tbe parties who had submitted to the jurisdiction of the Arbitrators refused afterwards to obey tbe aw ?~ d , then he wm tu be suspended from the Asaoci . ttlor . The Solicitor-General—Tbat was a report of the Arbitration Committed , my Lord . \ Mr . O'Connell—The proposal was in the shape of a report , but it never was adopted by the committee . The reason I proposed to have this paper read distinctly was to meet that , and to , show tbat the ultimate plan adopted was embodied in the rules you bave heard read . i
The Solicitor-General—I think , my Lord , Mr . Ross proved that document to which you bave referred . The Chief Justice—I bave it in my notes , somewhere . Mr . Brewster—Mr . Jackson produced a copy ; Mr . Ross said he had not a copy , but ; he proved that tbe document was adopted . i Mr . OConnell—If it was proved , let the document be produced , but I submit that tbis is tbe final adoption of tbe plan . Mr . Brewster—It ia the report of ttie sub-committee appointed some day in August , 1843 . The description of it is , " A Report of tbe Sub-Committee appointed on the 9 th of August , 1843 . to consider the subject of a general system of arbitration throughout tke country . " The date it was recsived , I baiieye , was tbe 21 st of Aucuat , 1843 . '
Mr . O'Connell—Was that document read by tbe officer ? All I want ia , my Lord , that the document should be fairly before the Court Mr . Brewster—This is a different document Mr . O'Connell—You had better have it read pgnin ; bere it is in print , it will be easier read . Mr . Brewst 9 r—That is a different document Mr . O'Connell—I will read a portion of it , and then Mr . Brewster will be better able to judge . ( Mr . O'Connell th « n read the title of the document , and handed it in . The manifold copy wai also handed up to the Court , and tbe officer : was requested to read it ) ' Some Repeal documents which had been proved , were here read , and put iu as evidence . Chief Justice—What is that , Mr . Bouine , that you are reading now ?
It is , my Lord , the diploma for the appointment of church wordenp . A—a—a—Repeal ; Wardens , I mean , my Lord —( laughter . ) Mr . Thomas Parker , a lithographic printer , was called , and proved the printing of the cards of associates , members , and volunteers , by order of Mr . Holbrooke , in whose employment he was at the time . He also stated that he had seen Mr . Ray and others of tbe Traveraers at Holbrooke ' s office , suggesting alterations in the designs of the carda while the work was in progress . { The cards were read by the officer of the Court , The name on the member ' s card we $ William Wylle . " Tbat on the volunteer ' s card was " ' William Greene , " Liverpool . "
On Parker ' s cross-examination he stated , that Mr . Ho ! brook was printer to tbe Government , and that Government business was being executed at his premises at tbe same time that the Repeal cards were ' n course of preparation . Isaac Gardiner and John Annealey , workers in Mr . Holbrooke's establishment , were also examined , to prove the printing and delivery of the cards and the diplomas for Repeal Wardens . Mr . J . UJick M'Namara was then examined , and stated that be was not a professional reporter , but was employed by Ceptain Despard , the stipendiary mB ? iBtrate , to attend the meeting at Tullamore in July hit , to report the proceedings . At that meeting Mr . O'Connell , Mr . Steele , aud Mr . J . O'OonueH , wsre present' . Tbe witness waa about to read from his notes , when
Tbe Attorney-General rose and said he observed that two of tbe traversera were absent , and he understood that they had left to attend a public meeting at the Conciliation Hall : unless they attended in Court , he must insist ou their recoguiz ^ uces being estreated . The two absentees 1 Mr . O'Connell land Mr . Stsele ) were sent for , und witbin a fow minules appeared in Court . The witness then read from hia notes an account 0 ! the meeting , and stated , that be saw banners and placards with the inscriptions , " See tbe couquerin ¦• Hero comes ; ' " Ireland , her Parliament again , or the world in a bloza . " The placards were posted on the walls of the town . :
On cross-examination the witness seated that he had been employed to attend the meeting by Captain D < -spard , resident magistrate for the Government . After writing the transcript of bis notes , ha lent them to hia brother-in-law , and afterwards to another person . Tbe cross-exaniination of this witness , who stated that he had been for some time employed on a [ provincial paper , occupied a considerable time , but it was very uninteresting John Simpson Stewart was next examined—He said , I am a sub-inspector of the constabulary . I was stationed at Tullnmore in July last Was there on the 16 th of that month . Waa about town the morning of tho meeting . Saw mottoes and banners iu my progress through tuo town before the meeting waa held . A large number of persons came to town to attend tbe meeting . There were many thousands of persons in the streets . Observed a banner with a motto in Highstreet , Tullamore . I took a note of it .
Mr . Tomb—Does that book in your hand contain your own handwriting ? It iises . What was the motto that you saw in High-stTeet ? Mr . Henn—I object to that question . It does not yet appear where the banner was placed . Ik appears that it was seen in tbo town before the meeting took place , but surely there should be E . ome furtber information respecting it . The banner might bave been fixed in the nigbt while scarcely anybody was in the town . It <\ oea not appear tbat it waa carried round by any person . The mere foot of a paper being posted is no evidence , and I— '
Tbe Lord Chief Justice—You will observe that all that took place canuol be givi n in evidence all at oue time . What the witness has already sworn to amounts to this . He was iu tlie town of TuUamore on the day of the meeting discharging his duty as an officer of police . He saw tbat a number of porsons had come into tbe town , and that tbe persons amounted to several thousands , and that h « in tho exercise of his duty went round the town for the purpose of making hia observations . He says that bo 8 aw multitudes collected in different parts with banners and mottos . Mr . Henn—No , my lord . Now that ia the very foundation of my objection—the banners or mottos weTe not brought in by any of those paTSons ^
The Lord Chief Justice—You interrupted me too soon . I said over and above those persons collected . who did not belong to tho town , thereiwere thousands of persons in different parts of the town ; and it was tbe duty of the officer to see vsbat was taking place . Now , he observed , when he went about in his tour as inspector , sundry banners and mottoes . I know he did not say they were brought in by the nonresidents , but that while the preparations were going on— ¦ Mr . HeDn—With great respect , I beg to observe that he haa not aaid in what part of the town—The Lord Chief Justice—Because you have not allowed him . Mr . Henn submitted that the fact of a placard being posted In High-street or any other part of the town , was no evidence tending to affect any person present . The Lord Chief Justice—You cannot prove
everything all at once . The examination resumed . ; Several thousand persons were assembled in the High-street , at TuUamore , when I went there . They were coming in great numbers into the town ; and many of them passed by High-street . High-street leads into the town from the Burgh-road . There wa 3 an arch across the whole of that atree' There was a moUo upon that arch . < The Attorney-General—What was it ? Mr . Ht-nn objected to that question . The erection of the arch ia question did not appear to be the act of any of tbe parties at the meeting , and did not affect tbal which the Court had then to try . Mr . Justice Crampton—The same objection would apply to the platform . ; The Attorney-General said that the objection bad already been decided , in the case of the King aga < p ? t
Hunt . The Court ruled with the Crown . ; The examination of tbe witness was then proceeded with , and he deposed to having been present at tbe Tullamore meeting . There was an arch over the street , on which was written , " The slave master may brandish hia whip , bat we aie determined to be free ; " "Beware 1 PbjBical force is a dangerous experiment ; " Repeal shall not be put down by bayonets . " On a well near to the place of meeting waa written , " Ireland , her Parliament , or the world in a bltza , " " Ireland
shall not be a serf nation , " " God eave the Queen , " and other inscriptions . A great number of persona went in procession with bands . There waa also a large body of horsemen , who came ia sections of four . ( The witness identified Mr . O'Uonnell and Mr . Sfceele rs being present on the occ asion ) . I wds about twelve yards from the platform . I took a few notes of what Mr . O Connell said . I wiU read fromjthat note a few passages : — " He was certain of Repeal ;• be called Lord Benumont " a despicable feilow ; " be alluded to SU Robert Pebi having declared tbat he would prefui
Untitled Article
I civtl war to the granting of Repeal ; and Mr . O'Conne'l then said tbat " he hurled at him a high and haughty defiance . " He afterwards asked the people if they I would be ready to meet him there again : but thinks he went on to say that he would not want them , or something to that effec ' - . I estimate the number of persons from 60 , 000 to 70 . 000 exclusive of the inhabitant of the town . Xbe members of the bands had fancy dresses—some wbite , some green and white . Cros 3-exarained by Mr . Henn—I bave a knowledge of shorthand . I was apprized of the intention to hold the meeting in question . I attended it st it we ? my duty to do ; and I reported it to my superiors aa it wri abo my duty to do . I was about twelve or fourteen ¦ yards from Mr . O'Connell when he spoke . Heard him speak about Ribboniam ; but just at that
particular time I lost the thread of the discourse—( laughter ) . . It was according aa Mr . O'Connell spoke high or' low that I was able to hear or otherwise . Went to the place of meeting tba night before it took place . I am not positive that I saw the arches of which I spoke on Saturday night . The motto of which I spoke—namely , " Repeal or a blaza , " I did not see the night before the meeting . It was there on the Sunday morning . I will not swear that it was taken down before the meeting took place . Will not swear that it wn not taken down by Mr . Steel . I was at the meeting . I was fn the stores over the pisiform . I took
down the mottO 3 that vt ere posted about tbe place of meeting and on the platform . I saw the motto , " Repeal , or Ireland in a blaz ? , " at twelve o ' clock ou the day of the meeting . I don't know thai I took aH tbe mottos down , but I took all tbat were publicly exposed , all that were across the streets and on the platform- I will not swear tbat I took down all the mottos , bnt I did take down the principal ones . I don't recollect seeing a banner with " the rose , thistle , and shamrock , ' * and " The Queen , God bless her , '' on it . Received directions on the . Saturday to attend the meeting . I did so , and on the Monday I forwarded nay repoifc .
Mi . Neal Brown , a magistrate of Tullamore , was next called and examined by Mr . Napier . I remember the Ropeal meeting held in Tullamore in July lust . About one o ' clock on the Suaday that the meeting was held I was in uiy house , and Baw tbe people coming into tbe town from the west-ward . I did not go to church that day in order that I might be in readiness if required . There were bauds of music with the processions , and tbey played as tbe procession passed round the church to the place of meeting . ' This was about half-past two o ' clock in the day . I saw Mr . O'Connell and Mr . Staele there . The procession passed along fifteen abreast . I saw a number of people coming from the church . They came through my field . That was not the usurl way . The usual way wes to go down tha street that the procession came up . There were tbree bands . They bad uniforms . One of them had , in addition , scales on their ahouldeis . They r'vme down in column about five abreast , and preserved good order except in one or two places .
Cross-examined by Mr . Moore , Q . C—Have been a stipendiary magistrate at Tullamore sines 26 tb September , 1839 . ' I waa the officer who , through the inspector , directed Stewart , thel . a&t witness to attend the meeting . I had received directions to do so from my superior officer , on my report that such a meeting W 9 t likely to take place . There was no riot occurred at the meeting , nor any in tha town until eleven o ' clock at night . Roscrea is about thirty miles from Tullamore . Jonas Tkompson was next sworn , and gave evidence as to the meeting at Longford en the 29 th of May , and the display of various banners with similar inscriptions to those at TuUamora . He also read notes of the speech made by Mr . O'Connell , in which he said he
should not be content while a single Riband society existed in Ireland ; that if the people were peaceable , Ireland should have a Parliament ata . n 1 and tbat they were then to go home , and when be wanted them again , he would let them know . There were about 40 , 000 persons present . In describing Mr . O'Connell ' a speech and manner at the meeting , he represented him as saying : — " I can tell you ours is no vain cause ; let there noi he any Ribbon societies in this country . We are peaceable . Let them but attack us , "—[ then there was a pause , ]—" we stand at their defiance ! Let Peel and Wellington get their Act of Parliament , we will find a way to drl 7 e a coach-and-six through it . " Respecting tbis matter the witness was
Cross-examined by Mr . Fitzzibboa to the following effect : — Was Mr . O'Connell ' s speech about Ribbonism , and tbe other part you read , spoke ia the samo tone of voice?—Yes ; I should think it was ; but the pause was made in such a way as to convey a meaning which I can :: ot describe , but which may be understood by the speaker : and those who wore listening to blip . We * J there any one with you at Longf « rd ? Another head-constable Mat ; uire—Did he take notes ? No ; W 3 were sent there to observe the meeting , and to take such notes ?•? wa might be able to take at tho tinia . —That is what you considered it material to take notes . of ? Yes so I . understood . —Yes , that is the way you understood your
instructions—so Mr . O'Coiinell made a speech ? Yes . — And you say that be made a very significant pause in it ? Yea , he made a very significant pause . —What did it mean ? It was such a language as was intended to convey something not expressed —( Inughtrr ) . —And to convey that to 40 , 000 persons ? Ic ' was impossible for Mr . O'Conhf 11 to be heard by 40 , o 00 persons j only a few hundreds could hear him . Could not the pause bave been seen by the 40 , 600 peraons ? I cannot aay so . —Were you bahind when he made this mighty pause ? Yes , I occupied the position I have stnted . —Turn your back to the jury , and Bhow theTi what kind of pause Mr . OConnell made with his back to yon I Really . I don't know where the jury ara —There they are—and be good enough to express tha pause to the jury ? I
don't think I could so successfully express the pause in the same form that Mr . O Connell did —( laughter ) — You did riot see hia face while he was making the pause ? It was Mr . O'Connell ' a form of language . — But I am not talking of language , but the pause . Did you aee his face while be was making the pause ? I may not have seen bis f ; c «; I cannot recollect that I saw his face . —You d ^ n't recollect wiiether it wa = i hia face or his back you saw ? Did he turn his face to you ? Not to me . —How long was that pause—that significant pause ? It might be three , or four , or five seconds ; it was not a minute certainly . — Did he make any pause but the one in hia whole speech ? He did ; but not such a pause as that —The pause of three eeconds wrs then the vury longest ? I don't say three
seconds ; it may have , been three seconds . —What waa he saying while he waa making that pause ? He was saying nothing of course —( laughter ) . — Will you tell me what be was saying before he paused ? Can you tell nie . from your memory ? Yonr questions are eo rapid th . it my memor ' y will not allow me to t < - ! 1 you without reference to the manuscript—Teil us now what ha wr-3 saying btfore he made tbe pauss ? One of the touses wus in thia sentence , " To submit to the Saxon and oppressor , and to be ground to the dust , but we wera never conquered : "—that ia tbe h ? st description of the pcu ? e I can give you . —O , I ace . We were gvounrt to t ! -, e oust and then be made the pause ? " To 6 ubtr . it ' to 'he Saxon and oppressor , to be ground to tba i- utt bnt "—( loud laughter ) , I am afraid I am
putting } ou Ina-. ' alse position to ask you to iraitara . dr . O'Connell ? Indeed , B r , I don't desire to imitate him . I a answeT to further question ^ the witness said , I . irri' ' ^ , in Lngford on the 27 th , snd the meeting ^ as lieM on Sunday . There -Ft - re no riohi there . I was not sorry for that . Tbo people came into meetir . 2 in a most disorderly manner , leaping , and shouting , a ^ d br&Briislr . ng tbtir sticks ; bu * . of course , they were not # oing to quarrel with one another . I did not hesr tt 3 testimony of the last witness . Tbis conduct wes exhibited by large bodies of men as they cams to the place of meeting , from ten o'clock urn . it two ved
o'clock in the afternoon , when Mr . O CoaneH : > rr . Indeed tho people were ina sweating ruge of ex ^' ament — ( laughter ) . They were led on by persona vrLo-m I believe to be prieati . I saw no sticks in the iriesti hands thai I can recollect . I saw soaio of ; be pnrtie 3 pulling others off tbe platform , and I might bav ; si en a momentary anger arise , but will not swear tbat it did . I was in the honse of Needham the chandler a . t the time . There wcie no p- j ikemen there ; indeed , tbey dare not apptur . I was not afraid because by tbe directions of wy tupL-rtor I was in coloured clothes . The meeting was jcrf ^ etly obedient to Mr . O'Connell'a orders . —Was it ioud
abouting that you heard ? It was . —Then every persoa must have heard it as well ; is you ? 1 suppose so- I mi )? ht have heard the shouting further iff fr ., 21 iha spot where I stood . —And you must have seen tha winding of sticks ? I did . —It was a ymy re ^ srljabJe thing , was it not ? Yea . —And you saw no po . icc there except between the hours of eight and ten in tLc : m » rning ? I saw police there in the early part of t ? x- t&orr ing . I would say about eight to ten o clock .-- DU ! juu see policemen in the streets till eleven c ! " -cki I might have seen an odd one—( a lau ^ ¦ ¦ . —Wn he firmed ? Ha n » ay hava had 3 rnis . M * . Fitgibbon— :. ly Lords , tbtsc ara tbu only answers I can get froai ihe witnwa . Witness—Indeed , Sir , I ' am iL .-posed to answer you
Mr . Fitzgibbon—Your disposition , Sir , ia a mavter for tbe consideration of tbe jury . No ^ , M » me , did yea see police in tbe street ikat dty , and uon t give me a may be answer to it ? 1 can ouij give you the same answer 1 gave to jou before : I uu . y have seen them . Mr . Fifzgibbon ^ - Y . 'U may so do ^ u , Sin—daughter ) . To Mr . Warren—The puiice had orders to remain in their bsrracks that day . You tpoka <> f Mr . O'Cocnell having rae ^ e a pause . Did you ever hear of cat ' s , paws ? I did , and I hewd of
people being made caVs pa , w = u £ also . ( Great laug hter . ) Mr . Fiizjibbou— And tl » .. t atosa out of liij' wua--examioaiion ! Well , 1 fcciru aa exclamatiou , a lew days ege , from tke othw muv . ' , "' And that wu tiiid by one of hur Majesty ' s couns-.:. " I think I may ^ tii say now : " Aud that -was said by one of her Jilajeaty ' s Bbrgeanto , u-s arising out of my czoss-exaunr . auoa in a cr / Jii'cel cise . " The witness ha % l » e left the table a few minuted after bnlf-past four » VKtk . the Chief Justice dw . tt « l * at the Court thotOii V at > JniM » ed to ten o clock uexc morning ( Continued in « itr Eighth pagc . j
Untitled Article
^ jANgABY 27 , 1844 , __ ======= , THE NORTHERN STAR- . . f ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ^ _ — tf ^ TT —^ flh ^ ^ " ~ - ~ —J , ^_ ^ & *^« ¦ um 11 *^^ - ~ . . - 1 _ — _ m . ¦ ^ - _ M 1 - ~ .. _ ¦ * — — . _»_^ __ . _ - __ _ ^_ . _ . . — __ ^
-
-
Citation
-
Northern Star (1837-1852), Jan. 27, 1844, page 7, in the Nineteenth-Century Serials Edition (2008; 2018) ncse.ac.uk/periodicals/ns/issues/vm2-ncseproduct1249/page/7/
-