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HOUSE OF LOBDS—Fbiday , Ateil 25 . The Dissenters' Chapels * Bill vras read a second time . 'The Earl of Bipdn , in reply to the Marquis of Norxnanby , gave the » me intimation respecting the recall of lord Kllenboroogh from India , u was given in the &oase of Commons by Sir Robert PeeL T&e recall is sot ¦ with the eonsentof the Government , ihs power being exsreSsefl by the E sat India Csmpanv , lord Bs-oxtquah expressed Ma surprise that the Board el Directors o ! the East India Company shonld have the power of recalling a Crovsrnor-General with , out the consent of the Board of Control . It was sorely an oversight in the framing of the Act -ot Parliament . The Marquia ^ f IiASSDCWSE said it was not an oversight , for the point had been maturely considered Trfeen the Act in question -was pissed .
Lord Poktjun moved the second reading of the Titndlerd and Tenant Compensation Bill , which was oppose 1 by Lord Beatthoki , and carried , on a division , by 27 to 19 .
SlOSCAT , A ? B"CL 29 . The Dsie of Weli . i > -gtos , in reply to Lord Colchester , stated that the Court x > f Directors of tbeJEast India Company had given their reasons lor the recall of Lord EOenborcngh , with which , howexer , the Government did not agree , as they approved of the policy and cor > flnct of the Governor-General . The business was chiefly of a formal nature , advancing measures through various stages .
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HOUSE OF COMMONS-Pbhut , At&il 25 . On the qnestion that the Leeds and Bradford Railway Bill bs reported , Mr . Hxbdt moTed as an amendment , tbat the Bill be recommitted , in order to afford an opportunity of hearing evidence as to the merits of another line , which the Committee had declined to consider . After gomediscnsaion , the House divided For the amendment „ ... 153 Against it ......, „ .. . „ , 56 Majority ............. 1 V 2 The Bill was then ordered to be recommitted .
XEO&LL OF 10 SD XLXBKBOHOrGH . In answer to a qnestion from Mr . SLicatjlaTj Sir Robert Peel said that en Wednesday last he had received a notification from the East India Company , signifying that , in the exerdsa of that will and pleasure which the law allows them , they had dedSed on recalling Lord EUenborongh from the Government cf India , Mr ^ MjLCAtrL » y said that he would , under these circumstances , indefinitely postpone his motion on toe affairs of G * alior , ss it was proper that the Noble Lord should be permitted to arrive in this country , in order to defend himself .
tTHE BAIH "WA 5 P AGAI 5 ! Mr . Roebtjck , referring to the retort made by him last Wednesday on Hx . Smytbe , read a letter addressed to Mm by that Hon . Member , calling npon him for a retractation , with a hostile alternative . The letter was read at the table . Mi . Ssmtihb said : Mr . Boebudrt practice was alxray « to try if hs could take members by surprise . Ha had himself received no message from Mr . Roebuck ; tbe message brought to him from that gentleman was only that Mr . Smythe should hear from him . It had , however , come to his knowJedge . through another
channel , that 2 £ r . Roebuck did intend to bring this matter before tbe . H&use . * Mr . Boebuck had some weeks ago imputed to >» Tm that be was actuated by disappointment at not obtaining offlea . He had immediately written to his constituents a letter , which he had published , disclaiming that motive , and a *» nring them thai fee hadaerer even applied for the smallest favour . Nevertheless , Mr- RoefcEck on Wednesday had repeated the insinuation . The matter having been brought by Mr . Boebnek this evening in this a&ape before the Sous * , Mr . Smythe felt that he had nc longer any alternative bat to apologise to the House for having unintentionally caused them any trouble .
Sir R . Peel suggested that both Members should be called on to give their assurance that this tnn ^ r should proceed no further . Mr 7 B 0 BBrcK had never intended that it should proceed further . Mr . 8 peas . es called on Mr . Smythe for hit as-Xurance . Mr . Sin the was demurring , when the Speaker repeated hit Injunction , with which Mr . Smythe then © amplied .
HB . PBBBXM ) . The _ order of the day having been read for the attendance of Mr . Pemnd in his place , The Spkaxxb inquired if the Hon . Member was In Displace ? Mr . Feksattd , who sat "in his usual seat , rose , and l » wed to the Speaker . The Clerk at the table then proceeded to read ib « extracts from Mr . Ftrrand " B speech whichhad been laid on the table on a former evening . Some merriment was exeited by the abrupt way in which he began : — " I know a little about Sir James Graham ; IhaTebad to battle against him when fighting the canst of the working classes in this country ; and a man who took steps loproeore a report which was false , merely for the
parpese of crushing a Member of the House of Commons who raised his voice in defence of tha suffering poor , would not hesitate to keep the working daises in the manufacturing districts in a -state of degrading slavery—ichetrs ) . What was his conduct in mj own ease ? I stuck to tha man like a leech—( loud cbsers ) . I told him the report ef Mr . Mott , his A writtent Poor Law Commissioner , was false . I was determined to bring it before the House until justice was done . " ~ * 'That ib not all Sir J . Graham has done cf late for the pur * pose of putting down the advocates of the poor in the House of Commons . Tou will remember that Mr . Walter was returned for Nottingham , and I have had the honour of battling by that gentleman ' s side the enemies of the poor—( loud cheers ) . No Tn « . rc has
resisted the New Poor Law more vigorously or at a greater sacrifice of time and money than Mr . Walter—( cheers ) . It was , therefore , felt necessary by Sir J . Graham to get him out of the House of Gammons , { or Sir Jai ^ s was a man who could not bear to hear the truth spoken , especially on that subject . A petition was presented against Mr . Walter ' s return . The committee sat several fays -and entered into an Inquiry as to the alleged bribery and corruption which Mr . Walter had committed in obtaining his seat . They could not preve that he had spent oca farthing , nor had he ; they oonld only prove Jhat his friends in the town of Nottingham , not bis agents , had spent between £ 30 snd £ 40 in money , and what they called treating .
The committee was divided—mere were three Whigs Ior throwing T » tti out , and three Tories for keeping Mr . Walter in . Mi . Hogg , the member for B&veriey , one of the most pure boroughs in the kingdom , for-BootS— Jloud Itugbter )—whether he got his . seat for ; £ i 0 I do not know—but this Tory ^ chairman aiaed Sir James Graham and the Government in unseating Mr . Walter . Mr . Hogg tried to explain away his conduct en that occasion ; the whale of the Government side of the House , on which I sat , listened with feelings of disgust wMle he higgled and haggled through , his explanation ; but there was one man who "vociferously cheered , snd that Tine man was Sir James Graham—floud cheers ) . "
Mr- TxnTuyp then rose and said , —Mr . Speaker , I owe , Sir , in the first place , an apology to this House for having b * en unintentionally the means of taking up so much of its valuable thna . Sir , had notr the Hon . and Learned Member for Bath taken me by surprise on tast occasion , —{ load -cries of hear , hear , ) I thonld certainly , ; on it flection , have given him the snr ? er which ike _ Hon . Member for PLasbnry recommended- fHear . ) But , Sir , having in the error of the moment been indnced to reply to the question of -the Hon . and Learned Gentleman , 1 am sorry that I should have been the caust of thus taking up the time of this House . Sii , I owe another apology to the working classes in the factory districts of England , fox hiving been the means of depriving th m of one
moment of this sacred evening ; for , Sir , they are expecting- that there will be thia evening a debate on a question of such vital importance as to be one either of life or death to tens , of thousands of that wretched class . Bit , iiope the House will do me the justice to belisve , Ehat if in any remarks of mine , either of a public or a private nature , I filial ! have wounded the feelings of any individual , I should ever be prepared to give that explanation to Vhat individual which one man of honoor has a right to expect from another—ihsar ) . Sir , it appears tome that there hare been incorrect conclusions arrived at as to what I have said and done -with reference to the subject which the Hon . and Learned Member biousht before the House . On Monday evening last , as far as my recollection goes , I said to this House
that rbelieVBd erery word as reported in The Times newspaper which related to the Right Hon . Gentleman the Home Secretary and the Hon . Member for Beverley -was strictly true , but I would not vouch for them until I agai-i referredto that paper ; and , if they were correct I would come down on the following day and fearlessly svow or disavow them . I-redeemed my pledge . I came down , I ^ ssyy / with & foil intention of doing- » , and I . ' avowed "them to be eerrect" Sir , the House , labours" under sa incorrect impression when it supposes that I ° » M driven- from - the House bj the jade and tmmarJy ixttrruptioa offered to me by Hon . Members . bppositMa cry of " Order" ) , or Siat I fled from the eharge 1 aonght _ aga ! nrt me by the Hon . Member for Birth , -The charge was , that I used
eertain language ' as affecfiog those two Hon .- GaBtlemem , sna I admitThsV-i ^^ d-so , -Every word reported in Vat paper . I ntteredat iheLeeds meeang . In leaving the Hesse J adopted the precedent which has been pursued by Hoa- Wimbers placed in the peealiar posl > tion of myself . " ^ rreteea tromit , conaideraif' iiat it Trtrald have beech krtpropfer in me , snd impertrDent to ^' Hoase , if-JEremained onsiooaisBtia ^ er ia *} and havlBf leaeemedmy .-pledge , I lsftit , lest I shonld be aaimpediment in the way of ita " future discussion oa thisiubjeet . Sir , I have " beenbordered by . the ' House of Common * to appiear . iiHiBfplace to-day * I have reipeetfuJy obeyed the summons , as I willrespectfully obey every smmmans or order which tha . House may g ive me , it 1 am jastified in doing so—{ hear , and a langh ) . Sir , ' I am : gi ? eo to Bnderjfead , if 1 « m
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prepared , in my place this eveniDg , to plead guilty to the charge which the Hon . and Learned Member has made against me , that I shall receive a free pardon at the hands of the House ; but that if I do not plead guilty the Honse wiil then proceed to pass sentence upon me without even examining into the evidence—( "No no ! " answered by cries of "Hear , hear" ) . That it will then proceed to pass sentence on me without producing evidence as to the construction that it has formed on the words I used —( " No , no . ' " and " Hear , hear ) . ** Sir , 1 hope 1 -may be allowed to say cue word is to ths conduct hitherto puiseed by this self-constituted court of honour . Mr . Speaker , no man ever
sat in that chair who conducted himself with more strict impartiality , more gentlemanly demeancur , or more graceful bearing than yourself —( " Hear , " and cbters ) . But , Sir , in your new effice of Judge of thia Eelf-constituted court of honour , you have even found the greatest difficulty in acting with impartiality . Sir , the other evening { pointing to Mr . Roebuck ) , when that common informer ( The Hon . Member was interrnpted by loud cries of " Order" ) . Sir , I retract the words , but I never will retract the sentiment —( laughter and cheers ) . Sir , when that public accuser—( the Hon . Gentleman was again interrupted by an observation from some Hon . Member sitting nsar him on the
Ministerial beeches , and ,. turning towards the quarter whence the interruption proceeded , he exclaimed )—That is a Parliamentary phrase , and it is ungenerous to attempt to interrupt me . Sir , when that public accuser ( pointing to Mr . Roebuck ) attributed falsehood to me the other evening , I declared that hla language wasun . gentlemanly . Ton , Sir , called me to order . When one of the witnesses in this prosecution read his evidente against me , be supported it by engrafting on that evidence a leading article of the Times newspaper . The leading men of both political parties in this House attacked me with violent language—nay , one of them , in language most unjustifiable , imputed to me a criai * of which be himself in doing bo was guilty . Is he a fit judge to ait here ? I admit that a more
noble er generous-hearted man never trod the soil of Britain ; but , under the excitement of the moment he uttered expressions which I am convinced he will much regret The yelling for revenge which itsued from the jury must yet be ringing in your ears . Nay , Sir , let the House recollect that the Prime Minister of England , wb . es I had scarcely quitted these walls , declared that mj absence had deprived it of considerable amusement As a member of this House , Sir , I solemnly protest against these proceedings . In the n&me of the people of England I pronounce this self-constituted court of honour to be an illegal and unconstitutional court ; and in the name of the people of England , I refuse to plead at its bar . [ The Hon . Member then resumed his seat !
Sib Jaues Gsaham said that as he had not recorded the same denial of the charge against himself which had been put in by Mr . Hogg with reference ts the charge against him , he would do so now , before he retired from the present debate . With reference to the affair of Mr . ilott , he had , upon careful search , been wholly unable to find any trace of any written or of any verbal communication from himself or f'ora the Poor law CoawlsBioneTs to Mr . Mott on the subject of the Kcighley Union . Hb repeated , therefore , that Mr . Ferrand hsA ma . de an erroneous assertion in saying that he had infiaenced s Commissioner to make a falsa report for the purpose of crushing a member , and then
dismissed the poor tool of his fabricatitna . Mr . Mott ' s ' dismissal was owing to circumstances quite unconnected with the Kfcighley Union ; and if a Minister bad been guilty of such corrupt conduct , the very consciousness of it would probably have deterred him from the dismissal of the " tool" employed by him . With respect to the accusation of haying influenced Mr . Hogg to displace Mr . Walter , he would say that he was much misunderstood in being represented t » entertain any anxiety for Mr . Walter ' s removal But being thus accused of an undue attempt in this matter , he claimed from the -justice of the House that he might be either proved guilty or acquitted .
Mr . James Wottley was disposed to make some allowance for the surprise npon Mr . Ferrand in Mr . Roebnck ' s sudden question ; and considered that Mr . Ferrand's charge did not bear the meaning put upon it Mr . Ferrand did not mean that Sir J . Graham had suborned Mr . Mott to falsify a report , but only that Sir J . Graham had pressed Mr . Mottfor a report , which turned out to be substantially a false one . Nor did he believe Mr . Ferrand to have meant that Sir J . Graham had employed any actual Interference hi the business of the Nottingham Committee . Mr . Ferrand made no explanation . Sir R . Peel was beginning to explain that be had been no Tolunteer in these proceedings , when The Speakeb called on Mr . Febbakd to withdraw from the House during the debate , which he did , Mr . Hog g and Sir James Gsabax following .
Sir R . Peel resinned . His own impression had been , that the matter was one of which it would be best to take no notice ; but notice having been token , it was now for the House to decide how they would deal with it He could not adopt Mr . Wortley ' s construction . H « argued that in both the charges the plain meaning of Mr . Ferrand was to conrty an imputation of corruption . * Were it otherwise , what could ha easier than for Mr . Ferrand to disclaim that meaning ? The charge against Sir J . Graham was not like those sometimes made against the House in general : it was a specific allegation against an individual . He
presumed that the House would think it expedient now to decide thia matter . He would therefore move a resolution to the effect , that " the said Sir James Graham and the said J . W . Hogg , Esq ., having in their places denied the imputations cast upon them , and that the said W . B . Ferrand , Eiq ~ , having avowed that h « had used the said expressions , snd having declined to substantiate them , this House is of opinion that the imputations conreyed in the said expressions are wholly unfounded and caluamions , and do not afFact is the slightest degree the hoaonr and character of the Hon . Members to whom thej refer . "
Mr . T . Dcscohbe proposed that Mr . Ferrand should fee called in , and interrogated whether he wished for an opportunity to substantiate his charges . Sit B Peel observed , that Mr . Ferrand had absolutely challenged their tribunal . Mr . F . FaESCH EaM , it appealed to Mm last the Right Hon . Baronet ( Sir R Peel ) bad not stated the case as it actually stood before tha House , for be had omitted one most important statement of the Hon . JJemstr ; it was this , —the Hon Member in his place in the House had stated distinctly that he meant to deny imputing to the Bight Hon . Secretary of State that he corruptly tampered with the Hon . Member for Beverley { Mr . Hogg )—( cries of O , !") He ( Mr . French ) said distinctly that the Eon . Member had disavowed any meaning of that sort That was left out by the Right Hon . Baronet ( Sir R . Peel ) in his statement of the case . He ( Mr . French ) regretted he was not able to go so far
as the Right Hon . Baronet ( Sir R . Peel ) and the House . The other night the Right Baronet { Sir } R . Peel ) had asked them to weigh the matter well , and consider all the important precedents , before they made up their minds . He ( Mr . French ) had considered the subject and referred to precedents , and these precedents he found very different from those quoted by the Right Hon . Baronet . He did not think it was for the dignity of the House that thia business should be proceeded with . Regretting , las be did , to allude personally to the Right Hon . Baronet and the Keble Secretary for the GolonieB , still , as this was a personal matter , any precedent , which could be in point must be a personal matter . On examining the precedents to which he had reftrred , be observed that & coarse more objectionable than that of the Hon . Member for Hnaresborough had been pursued by officers high in the state—( bear , hear ); be was sot one of those who considered that
" That in the captain's but a choleric word »« Which in the soldier is flat blasphemy ;" therefore he begged to move , as an amendment , the following resolution : —¦ " That , inasmuch as the Secretary for the Colonies did , on a former occasion , in bis place in this House , accuse bis late colleagues of her Majesty ' s Cabinet" — poud cries of " Oh , oh ! " ); Hon . GentlemeH should not put him down ; he would go through with his motion , whether Hon . Gentlemen considered it advisable or not—{ renewed interruption ) . He should go os . Hon . Gentlemen would only give him the trouble of reading his resolution a second time —{ hear , hear]— " of proceedings and practices , some ef
which invelved the low and infamous tricks of thimbleriggers—( " Hear , " "OhJ" and a laugh)—of which he offered no explanation or apology ; and inasmuch as tha Right Hon . Member fox T&uvworth did accuse , on a forsser occasion , the Hon . Slezaber for Stockport of exciting to the horrible crime of assassination , for which he offered no satisfaction or apology , it iB not fitting tha \ the House shonld discuss further the language of the Hon "Member for Kuaresborough -which is supposed to rtflsct on the Right Hon . Member for Dorchester and the Hon . Member for BbVerley . " No Hon . Member , however , seconded tbe ^ amendoent and
The Speakes having put the question , declared that the ayes had it Lord Johs Mankehs rose immediately , and was about to proceed , when he was informed that the question had been agreed to . He said that he was not aware the Speaker was putting the original motion , he thought it had bten the amendment . He would ask , therefore , whether there was now any opportunity of demurring to any part of the resolution . The Speaeeb— The resolution has already been acceeded to T > y the House : Tbere the" matter ended .
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in another and a constitutional court . Fur the anomalous position in which the House last night placed itself I am in no way responsible . . ; '; ¦ " With regard to ypuself and the expressions I made use of respiting you , I much regret that my assurance on Monday night , that you were * labouring under a mistake ' when you supposed that 'I had charged you with what was dishonest and dishonourable , ' was not , as I think it ought to have been , satisfactory to you ; and that you persisted in driving me to the alternative of either remaining silent or of jubmitttlrg to the interference of an unconstitutional tribunal Oa Monday night I distinctly told you what I did soi mean ; 1 now tell you what I did mean . It always was , and still is , my opinion that your decision respecting the Nottingham election was unjust , and directly opposed to the evidence laid before you ; it is further my opinion , that In
coming to this decision you werein £ uehoed by a bias , of wbish you , were probably unconstious , that such decision wonld be acceptable to a Government whom you were anxious to support , and more particularly acceptable to that individual member of it to whose favourable legislative measure Mr . Walter had ever been the strenuous opponent Further than this I never did , I never could , intend to say . I never for one moment believed , that yen had been personally corrupted , or that yon either were or are to . recelye' the reward of that corruption . Had I bo believed , or had I intended to convey such belief , it would have been done in plain English , and not by faint inuendo . I therefore wish to express my regret that your feelings as a mun of honour should have been wounded by unfortunately straining my words inte a meaning they were never Intended to eonvey .
" With regard to your conduot during this past week , no one can regret more deeply than I do that you should have lent yourself to the personal persecution with which I have been assailed . That , however , is mere matter of private feeling to myself . , But it is still more to be regretted on public grounds , when considered , as I fear the country will consider it , as having so materially contributed towards placing the House cf Commons in the embarrassing and unconstitutional position in which it now finds itself—a position ill-calculated to maintain its efficiency in public estimation—a position , in short , which presents it to the country no longer as the defender , but as the direct invader , of one of the dearest privileges of the subject " I am , Sir , " Your most obedient humble servant , W . B . Febeanc . " " J . W . Hogg , E :-f ., M . P .-
FACTOEIES BILL . Sir Robert Peel moved the order of the day foi going into Committee on this BilL Mr . J . S . Wortlet presented a petition in favour of a Ten Hours' Clause . Mr . Ross presented three petitions against it Mr . T . S . Dua'cojibe rose to move an amendment to discharge the order of the day , for the purpose of referring the Bill to a committee up stairs , which should take evidence ; and he did so for the purpose of having the public mind eatisfied upon a subject on which , he believed , there existed very grave and considerable doubc—he meant in reference to the tf&ct which limiting the hours of labour to ten , would have upon the pecuniary resources—that was , on the wages of the
operatives . He now asked this questi » D , what would betbetffect ? He was there to prove , as far aB he was able , and he hoped he should be able to shew to the satisfaction of the House , that very grave and considerable doubt did exist , net only in the House—perhaps it did not exist so much in the House—but in tae minds of the working classes of the country , that limiting work to ten hours , instead of having the effect of reducing their wages , would have tke effect of raising wages to a considerable degree . If there be such an impression on the minds of any considerable portion of the working classes , and if such an impression be unfounded , aa It was said to be in that House , he thought the working classes ought to have the power of submitting their evidence upon that point What were the opinions expressed by various Members of that House , and in the petitions pre *
sented on the part of the masters in reference to thia subjtct ? He would call the attention of the House to the petition which had been referred to by the Right Hon . Gentleman the Secretary of State tor the Home Bspartment , signed by sixty-two firms at Manchester , employing SO , 000 hands . That petition was presented by the Right Hon . Barenet the Secretary of State for the Hume Department . Those sixty-two firms said that the reduction of wages in consequence of the redaction in the hours of labour to ten , would be from fifteen to twenty-five per cent . The Right Honourable Gentleman himself stated that the reduction would be eighteen per cent The Learned Gentleman ihe Member for Lukeard thought the reduction would be about nine per cent , whilst a gentleman who had recently published a pamphlet , Colonel Torrens , believed the reduction would be twenty-five pet cent , and said that the Bill of the Noble Lord the Member for Dorsetshire
ought to bo called " A Bill fox tbfl reduction of the wages of the operative classes throughout England . " There was another petition , presented to the House by the Honourable Member for Stpckport , which stated the same reasons for opposing the Ten Hours' Bill . All the language of the petitions in favour of the ten hours did not touch opan the question of wages ; that was not brought under the consideration of the HouBe . He said that this was a most important element in coming to a decision upon tills subject—( hear , hear ) He had beard , whtn he was at Manchester the other day—where he saw delegates from ABhton , Sheffield , and elsewhere , and the subject was discussed , that they believed the effect ef the limitation would be to increase wages : they believed this in consequence of what they saw passing around ; and one of the parties from
Shtffield had favoured him with a statement of the operation of a reduced number of hours at Sheffield , and the impression of the working classes there . There was no town in which it was more distinctly understood and believed that a reduction of the houn of labour would cause wages to rise . He would call the attention of the Right Hon , Baronet to this : he was sorry to see that he . was not taking so much interest in this subject as he did when , it was last before the House . [ " I asiure the Eon . Gentleman that I am , " from Sir J . Graham J They maintained that the result of a limitation would be & raising of wages instead of & reduction , becauss this had been found to be the state of things at Sfetffiald . There sixteen trades had , at this moment , reduced the boms of work of their own accord , and this was the result : —
" The Sheffield spring-knife grinders , four months ago , were working sixty hours per week , and had three hundred men employed , with one hundred and fifty boys . They now work forty-two hours par week , and four hundred are employed , with two hundred and thirty boys , and work only forty-two hours weekly , with wages advanced at least twenty per cent , and have taken fifty paupers off the pariah , who now have their share of employment Daring the long hour system , from August to January , the trade was very brisk ; to use their own expressions , they worked 'all the hours God sent , ' but during the seven months work was just as they could get it—nothing t » do on Monday and Tuesday , and during the remainder of the week all hurry and buttle . Now they work sevsn hours
regular , and in the morning and evening can go and cultivate ta « ir gardens after their toil . Fork-forgers and grinders , under the long-hours system worked sixtysix hours , now work : thirty-six hours . Recently a rise in wages has taken place of twenty-five per cent ; formerly two hundred men were employed , now three hundred . R-zor-grinders formerly worked sixty-six boars , now they work forty-five , with an increase of wages ten per cent : three hundred teimsrtj , now four hundred employed . Table . blade grinders formerly worked sixty-six hours , now only thirty-six : increase In wages twenty-five per cent : increase of number employed , twenty per cent . Brace-bit grinders worked Bixty-six honrs , now thirty-six increase in wages , one hundred per ceat Table-blade forgers worked twelve , fourteen , and sixteen hours a-day , now uniformly work eight , with increased wages of thirty per cent : additional
number employed , one in seven . Table-knife cutlers worked on aa average fifteen hours , now ten . tesutt , increased wages , fifteen per cent ; number employed additional , one in seven . My time has not permitted me to ascertain the results in all the other branches of the trade , but I feel convinced that the alteration will have proved equally beneficial to the workmen . Britannia metal smiths worked eleven hours , now nine daily ; saw-makers worked sixty , ' now forty-eight wetkly ; file-grindera worked Bixty , now thirty-six weekly ; salssor-grinders . woikftd . eleven , now nine daily ; razar-forgers worked eleven , now nine daily . In the grinding trade every man has to pay 3 s . S 3 . for twelve hours power , whether thsy woik them all or not : they have to find their own tools , and neither their employers nor proprietors of the place will furnish fans or fiats for the preservation of life . "
The sen in the factory districts naturally believed that what took placs at Sheffield would take place elsewhere —( hear , hear ) . The delegates Baw no reason why it should not take place at Manchester as wall as Sbtfficld , nor did be —( hear , hear ) . At Sheffield they might work for twelve hours if they liked ; but by combination they agreed only to wort seven or eight hours , and they said the effect of this combination bad not been to depress wages—thear , bear ) . He said that this reqalredsome explanation . The state of trade at Sheffield was uot brisker now than last year , when , to use their own expression , they « worked all the hours that « od sent * ' Tet , when they were now working fewer hoursy they said their employment was more general , and they bad better wages . There aust be many Hon . Members thetf present ; who recollected the committee
obtained by Mr . Sadler in tho yeai 1832 . Thafc . committee madenareporti though it laid before the House a large mass of very valuable evidence .:, Now , what he ( Mr . Dancombe ) wanted was , that a report on the subject shouldiejnftdatoJthB House in order , to disabuse the minds ;« f : Hon » -iIenibers on this moavimpoitoJat subject . dOne of jtha witnesses . examined on that occasion ( Mr . Wyley , m wer understood ) stated bi » 3 strong persuasion thatfcTeiiBoMS' BULwouia be * , great advantage , and hisopiBioa , was , ihat . th& ; effeet of it -would be to $ Vie to the . working clasjesvmoie ; fa » tead . of Ie » s payment . Ifcws * the opinion of this witness , that wages were lower when the time of working was leog , and that if the hourt ^> f labour were limited the wages would rise rather than fall . Mr Brooke , of Leeds , was of the same opinion . He . never entertained a doubt that , if the hours of labour were . restricted , the tendency of
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such aregnlation would be to raise rather than depress -kV ^ I Wages' Ha alw « y « observed that , on the r ™ ' «» 9 wages were worse when the men were in the «* , ! »^! T i ? * * hours ' -Mr . Smith , a surgeon , who resided In Leeds , stated , that the general impresaZS iW" ^ * *** ¦ the BlU P'Oposed to be intro-¦ ffifWrtS 1 Sadlet WQnW d 0 Inucl 1 « - M ' - Oastler « rniw * . *^ e * idea « V ststed himself to be of the same opinion , and there was eveiy wason to believe ^ \ **•_?»«« BtlU field to the same oenli-Dflents . His ^ ( Mr . OastlM ' s ) opinion clearly was . tnat tae effect of tha proposed measure would
i it * i . ¦ ¦ £ & ° otl to ldwer wages . There m » ght » he thought , at firat be a little battle betwetn j-ii ^ " ? **» ¦ ¦» ' «» . and there might be some dimtaution of , profits , but those differences would aopn suDsiae , the number of masters would be somewhat diminished ; fo the competition amongst the employers was excessive ., If there were less work done , the m « n would get better wag 98 and the masters more profits . A committee rat in the year 1140 , and reported In 1841 , tmt that committee altogether blinked the question ; they made no report on the effect which a limitation of the : hours of labour wtuld have upon the rates of wages . The report of 1841 went more into
me pnysiqal and social condition of the operative classes < nan Into any other question , and it neglected the only point which would assist the House in its present deliberations , if the House would only agree to the motion which he had made , he undertook to confine himself t » the mere question of wages . He wanted to see if the difficulty with which they had to deal was merely one of wages . Amongst the existing disputants h « wanted to know who were right and who were wrong—the operatives or the masters —( hear , hear , near )—whether those who said that a Ten Hours ' Bill would lower wag « s twenty-five per cent , or those who held a different opinion—( hear , hear ) . He had received letters from the working classes
requesting ^ him not te bring on this motion for a Committee , bectiuse it would hang up the Bill , and their expression was that the Noble Lord would be able to carry his Ten Hours' clause . Every man of sense knew that , the Noble Lord had not a shade or a shadow of chance of carrying his Ten Hours' clauss on the third reading —( hear , hear ) . The Government would then toll him that they bad discussed all the clauses of the Bill in Committee , where it had b » en fairly sifted as it could be j for the Hon . Memb » r for Bath and the Hon . Member for Sheffield had given notice of amendments . The Noble Lord had fancied that the Houbb would go Into Committee , report the Bill , and pass the tbird reading , and that nothing would be said ; and then he w « uld eome down before th * Bill
passes with clauses , which would so contlct against othir clauBas already agreed to , that her Majesty's Ministers would , of course , resist the clauses successfully—( hear ) . The ; other day the Noble Lord thought that he ( Mr . Buncombe ) had not treated him with candour on justice . He neither intended any Uisrespsct to the Noble Lord , nor to treat him with any injusticequite the contrary . The Noble Lord told him that the working claaees understood their own interest tentiines as well , and had ten times aa much condour at him { Mr . Buncombe ) . So convinced was he that they did better understand their own interests , that he wished to give them the franchise , and permit them to have
representatives who would protect those interests—( hear , hear ) . He was sura the working classes would be happy and proud to hear the arguments of the freetraders before a committee , for they believed they could refute those arguments . If they did refute them , ho was sue an Impartial committee would bo raport ; and if they did not , and it waa thought the reduction of the hours of labour would have tha effect of diminishing wages some twenty-five per cent , he should be guided by the decision of the committee , and he believed the working men , having confidence in such a tribunal , would submit with better temper than they felt at present to the bill passing with the twelve hours ' clause .
Mr . Ward seconded the amendment , not because he wished to recede from bis opinions on the subject , but because he was convinced that no mf re majority could now settle the agitation , and it was expedient to give the working classes the means of proving what they considered to be their case . The advantage of this wonld amply compensate any delay which might take pl&ce in the progress of the bill . Sir J . Graham oppoaed the amendment After some observations from Sir Qeouoe Strickland , Mr . Hume spoke at considerable length against the impolicy , absurdity , and injustice of all and any Interference with the operations of capital and labour .
Mr . Escott opposed the amendment , and Mr . George Palmer ridiculed the Idea that a limitation of the hours of labour would affect the foreign trade . After a speech from Mr . Yillier . 3 , Lord Ashley said that the workpeople were very anxious for other parts of the Bill , as well as for a limitation of time , and that they considered the whole Bill to bo a memt important improvement on the existing system . Ho deprecated any delay , which be was sure would be felt by the working people as a bitter disappointment , and he entreated Mr . Duacombe to withdraw his motion .
Mr . Cobden said , he was sure that if , by giving one hour to the working classes , he could confer upon them the blessings promised by the advocates of a Ten Hours ' Bill , no one would more readily consent to do so than himself ; but the qnestion was , whether the Ten Hours' Bill would benefit the working classes , if their wages were reduced in proportion to the reduction of their hours of labour—( hear , hear . ) There was a great disposition to shirk the question , which was one of mere fact —/ hear ) . He would tell Hon . Gentlemen , that If they passed a Ten Hours' Bill , which would reduce not only labour , but wages also , they were under a great delusion if they supposed such a measure would be beneficial to the working classes—( hear , hear ) . The real question raised by the Hon .
Member for Finsbury was a most important one , namely , * " Will the reduction of the hours of labour reduce the rate of wages ? " How were working men in cotton factories paid ? Generally by the piece . He had met with but two arguments which ceuld possibly account for the process of giviug the same rate of wages for a diminished time of labour . The first was , that tho spe « d of machinery would be increased , and as much got in ten aa in twelve hours , and therefore the labourers would get as much wages . Tbe beat informed manufacturers and millowners had informed him that their machinery was already driven by steamengines as fast as it was profitable to work it ; and that tbe tendency of the Ten Hours' Bill would ba rather to diminish speed than to increase it , because more
would be lost in waste than gained in production , and therefore the labourer would suffer in proportion Auothor argument Was , that by diminishing the hours of labour from twelve to ten , production would be diminished in the market , which would sell at the same price , because there was no more to be sold , and there weuld be one-sixth more mills erected to produce the eaa . e quantity of cotton goods which were before produced . Tho fundamental fallacy of that argument was , that it went upon the assumption that there would be a fixed quantity of goods sold , whatever tbe prices might be , forgetting that the sale depended npon the cheapness of those goods , and that we had an enormous production and sale solely by cheapness , which bad arleon partly from machinery
and our facilities of coal an 1 iron , and partly from the long labour of the workpeople . The spinningjenny , the handfooru , tbe d ( stuff and the spindle , had all been supplanted by machinery , the productions of which had been carried to almost every part of the world , to remote spots where thia csuntry wan hardly known by name , because of their cheapness . If the hours of labour were reduced , the wage- ? must be reduced ; for if cheapness were destroyed the market would be destroyed , for the people would be compelled to have recourse to tbe distaff and spindle , unable to pay a high price fo ? articles manufactured by machinery . A great deal bad bees said with regard to tbe conduct of the Free Traders upon the factory qitstion Ou both aides ef the House charges had been made against
those who advocated Free Trade opinions as if they were great advocates for long hours He begged to tell the Hon . Member for FLusbury that the working classes were no mote mote in favour of monopoly that any other class . Why , the charge made againat . Wni ( Mr . Cobdeu ) was , that at the public meetings which be attended in the country for the purpose of promoting the doctrines of Free trade he was supported by the rabble . This would not be the case were the working clasaws not opposed to monopoly . Instead of the supporters of Free Trade advocating the system of long hours , they maintained that the surest way , and the duly sound and practical mode of shortening the hours of labour , was by abolishing restrictions upon trade . He would in two words tell the House why ha thought
carrying ioto effect tbe principles of free trade would diminish the : hours of labour . He did not say , with the Noble Lord , tbe Member for the city of London , that by reducing the price of bread it ¦ would compensate the labourer for tho reduction of the hours of . labour —( hear , bear );—he did not see in the mere reduction of the price of wheat , or sugar , or coffee , the great means of enabling tbe operatives to got on with fewer hours of labour ; but he said this —that If . wa enlargsd the various markets for our productions , if we allowed a full and free exchange of our commodities for the corn , and sugar , ; and coffee of other countries , this would be the practical means of raising
the value of our products , and , consequently , of raising the value of the labour which produces them ; so that then , indeed , ten hours' labour would be as good , or better than twelve hours now tor ihe pockets , of the labourer , and produce as much profit to the employer . He ' iMr . Cobden ) should xota for the select committee , thinking it calculated to clear up , beyond a doubt , tnany disputed points which at present were ' made , use of to interpose serious difficulties , hi ^ the way of a proper adjustment of the whole matter—( hear ) . . The , House then divided . The numbers were—.. ' For , ^ e amendment ..., , i ,, ( 42 _ % . For . the original motipq ,. ¦ .. ' , ' .. ¦ ' " * " . ** 5 " . '
. , iM » jftrliy . » gate 8 tth 8 . ^ 6 nflm 6 nt ——iO 3 . The House then , went into Committee . Clauseo 1 and 2 were agreed to . : On clause 3 beiDg ' proposed , Mr . M . PHiLipa objected to the power U gave to the . sub-wepectors . : U « t thought it , Indeed , highly desirable there ehould be so sub-inspectors at all . He Baw no necessity whatever for two classes of inspectors ,
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and considered the employment of au inferior grade of officers calculated to render the measure less palateable . ; Sir J . Grab am said that j the clause restricted the existing power of the Inspectors ; it , among other things took from them the power they now possessed of framing rules and regulations for mills and factories . { The clause was agreei to , as was clause 4 . To clause S j Mr . M . Philips declared jhe had an insuperable objeetion . It weuld have the effect of establishing in the metropolis a central office or board in respect to factories , the necessity for which he did not see ; and the ultimate result of which he apprehended might be th « gradual establishment of a now department of administration altogether . Why should not the information necessary to be collected be communicated to the Board of Trade ? j
Bit J . Graham said , if that were agreed to , it would involve the transfer to that boar * of the entire management of the measure . The effect of the clause was only to give to the Home Department the aid o ( two or three clerks , who would constitute an exceed , ingly economical , but highly useful establishment , for taking advantage of all tho information collected by the inspectors . Considerable discussion ensued , in which this clause was stoutly contested . | The committee divided . The numbers were—For the cl . mse ..... 147 AgaiHfltit . ; , 53 Majority forjtbe clause ... 104 Clauses 6 and 7 were then agreed to . Clause 8 . ;
Mr . Brotherton said , the expenoe of surgeons ' certificates would be very serious—about £ 27 , 0 » 0 a year . There were about 4 , 500 factories , and if they calculated the expet . ee of surgeons' certificates , at 2 i 61 per week , that would amount to £ 27 , 060 a year . i After a few words from Sir James Graham , the clause was agreed to ; as was also clause 9 . Mr . F . Maule said he j thought Borne difficulty might arise in many cases in finding magistrates in tbe manufacturing districts who were not mlllowners . Sir J . Graham said , he would take tbe objection
into consideration . . The clause was agreed to . ¦ Clauses 11 to 15 inclusive were also agreed to . Clauses 16 , 17 , 18 , 19 , and 20 were agreed to . Clause 21 was agreed to . ' The Chairman tnen reported progress , and obtained leave to sit again on Monday next . The Committee on the Poor Law Amendment Bill was postponed till Friday , the 20 th of May . Oa the motion « f Mr . Aglionby , a Select Committee waa ordered to inquire into tbe state of New Zealand . The House then adjoured at twelve o ' clock .
Monday , April 29 . Mr . Scholefield presented petitions from the British and Foreign Anti-Slavery Societies at Chester-le-Street , Newton Abbpt , Helston , Cornwall ; Darlington and vicinity , Reigate , Surrey { Torquay and Oawestry , against any ] fiscal regulations being adopted that will admit of ] the introduction , of the produce of slave labour intoj this country , and praying that fiscal regulations ba adopted in favour of the produce of free labour . i Mr . S . Crawford presented a petition from operatives connected with factory work in Belfast , signed by 8 , 300 names , praying for the restriction of factory work to ten hours labour daily . Mr . Sctf oi . efield presented several petitions from Chester , Denbigh , and other places , against the importation of slave-grown produce into thia country . Mr . Leader presented a petition from Westminsteragainst the Masters arid Servants Bill .
, Mr . Long presented fort ; petitions from different places in Wilts , in favour of agricultural protection . Mr . Hindley presented several petitions against tho introduction of slave produce , and in favour of a ten hoars bill , one of each being signed by Thomas Clarkson . j Mr . T . Duncombe presented petitions against the Irish Registration Bill . I Also several petitions from Liverpool , Sheffield , and Rochdale , complaining of the present state of the tailoring trade , and praying for an inquiry . j Mr Mark Phillips presented a petition from Manohester , praying for a repeal on the duty on raw cotton . : Mr . Marshall presented ; a petition in favour of the ten hours' bill .
Mr . P . Howard presented a petition from Carlisle against the Masters and Servants' Bill . Mr . Hardy presented a petition from Bradford in favour of protection to agriculture . Mr . Fkrrand presented a petition from a meeting , of which he had baen chairman , against the Masters and Servants' Bill . Also a petition from Edinburgh to the same effect . i Sir Georgb Stricklanb presented a petition from Preston , against the Masters and Servants' Bill . Mr . Ewart presented aj petition , praying for a reduction of the duty on tea . Mr . Ainsworth presented a petition from Bolton , against the Masters and Servants' Bill .
LORD ELLENBOROUGH . A brief conversation took place respecting the recall of Lord Ellenborough from the Government of India . ] Sir Robert Peel restated that the recall of the Governor-General bad originated with the Court of Directors of the East India Company . The nomination of a Governor-General was vested in the Company , subject to the approval of tho Crown , but they had the absolute power of recall . The Court of Directors had not taken the Government by surprise , for the Executive ] were duly apprised of their intention before it was formally exercised ; but he declined entering on the ' subject , or stating the reasons for the determination . The Government would take care to prevent ! the inconvenience and danger which they foresaw would follow the proceeding . :
THE BUDGET . The House was crowded , ! in expectation of hearing the financial statement which was made by Tne Chancellor of the Exchequer , who occupied about two hours in making his statement . The House having gone into a committee of ways and means , he rose , and commenced by recapitulating his estimates , made last year , of the probable returns of the revenue , and compared them with the actual results . Placing them in a tabular form , the items stand thus : — I
Estimated produce . Actual produce Customs , £ 19 , 000 , 000 £ 21 , 426 , 000 Excise 13 , 000 , 000 12 9 ' ! 0 , 000 Stamps '¦ 7 , 000 , 006 7 , 011 , 000 Taxes 4 , 200 , 000 4 , 192 , 000 Posd Office ... 600 , 000 628 , 060 Crown lands J 130 , 000 147 , 000 Miscellaneous Estimates 250 , 000 268 , 000 China money money ... 870 , 000 803 , 000
Total £ 50 , 150 , 000 £ 52 , 835 , 124 This increase of realised over anticipated Income was favourable on the one ! Bide ; and that of the Expenditure was equally so pn the other . They had received more than they calculated on , and they had spent leas . The Charge for the Debt , and other items belonging to the Consolidated Fund , had been much the same as usual , the difference not exceeding £ 50 , 000 . There was ' an apparent reduction in tha actual expenditure for the Army , as they had estimated thafdepartment of expenditure at £ 6 , 619 , 000 , while the amount expended was only £ 6 , 118 , 000 . But this arose from the Indian Government having
contributed a larger ehare of the expences incurred , and the restoration of tranqiiility in the East had rendered it unnecessary to keep very large sums in the military cheats . There was also a reduction in the estimated expenditure for the Naval service of £ 650 , 000 . Last year there was a deficit in the reveu ' ue of no less than £ 3 , 400 , 000 , that being the amount in which the income was behind the current expenditure . Not only had the whole of this been cleared off , but there was a surplus revenue , after paying debts , of £ 1 , 400 , 000 . His estimate fcr the ensuing year is as follows t—Customs , estimated at / . £ 21 , 500 , 000 Excise ' i . 13 , 000 , 000
Stamps . 7 , 000 , 000 Taxes ' 4 , 200 , 000 Property-Tax ^ 5 >™ ° Afn Post-Office 600 , 000 Crown Land ^ 0 . 000 Miscellaneous 250 , 000 Total , in round number ? . .. .., £ 51 , 790 , 000 This is the estimated income for the enming year . The anticipated expenditure was , first , the charge for the Debt , which , last j year , was £ 29 , 130 , 000 , would be next year £ 27 , 697 , 000 , being an apparent
reduction of £ 1 , 400 , 000 . Tnis , however , was not a saving to the public , for it arose from the altered periods of paying the dividends , one of tne consequences of the measure for . reducing the Three-anda-Half'per cents . The real saving which would result from this reduction—( from which , by theway the amount of dissentients is very insignificant only £ 247 , 115 , considering the ' large amount of stock , £ 260 , 000 , 000 , to which the operation extends)—would be , for this yea * , ; only £ & 13 , 000 . The estimate of the expenditure for the ensuing year stands thus :... ¦ . - - . - - ;;¦¦ . (¦ . ¦ ; ¦ ' ¦ ¦ ,.- .. Consolidation Fund , including
DcfioienorBMs ... ... i .. ... ... £ 30 , 000 , 000 Army-... ... ; .. . « ... § . 616 , 000 . »«* :. •¦ « . ¦* .... * . ... \ ^ S Ordnance v .. ... ... i -. -H 8 gffi ' --Miscellaneous ... ... i .. ... ... ?» ° 9 ^ i Extrao » dinaries « . ... ' . * Q « » W 0 , TbMionadd ^ 200 J ) 00 , jU » provisioiafOTJfaylQR off the aissentienta from ] ^?> «? « a . ^ W CentCwid also a sum of £ 239 , 000 , being'thew-JMibdte ' of the Gnarahtee ] Fund / of the Soutb ^ Sj Company . The total expenditure , as TBSJkimatedfor trie ensuing year , is £ 16 , 643 , 170 ^ leaTJn ^ $ B apl ^ parent surplus of £ 3 , 148 , 000 , but a real one of £ 2 . 376 , 000 . j
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REDUCTION O ? TAXATION . General expectation anticipating a surplus revenue , he had been overwhelmed with applications for reductions of duties on every article which contributed to the revenue . The firat artiole he would deal with was glass . There was a distinctive duty between bottle and flint glass , which the great improvements ia tbe manufacture not only rendered usaless , but led to frauds on the revenue , by the sab * stitution of one for the other , in receiving the drawback on exportation . He proposed to equalise them , reducing the duty on flint glass to the rate oa bottle glass , that is , from twopence per pound to three farthings . This will stimulate trade , but the alteration will lead to a loss of _ £ 35 . 000 this year , the alteration not commencing till July , but
hereafter the loss on a full year is calculated at £ 45 , 000 . The next artiole is vinegar , on which the duty ia to be repealed altogether , and by which there will be a loss of £ 25 , 000 . Tho inducement to repealthis duty is its large use in manufactures , especially in calicoprinting . Next , the duty on marine insurances is to be altered and reduced . The duty was originally imposed in war-time ; when H was reduced by Lord Althorp the effect was favourable : at present it operates injuriously , by depriving ns of the full benefit of that resort to Britain in marine insurance , which our capital and our credit entitle us to . At present , on every £ 100 , where the premium is 15 s ., there is a duty of Is . 3 d . ; up to 30 s ., a duty of 2 s . 6 d . ; and above 30 a ., it is 5 s . He proposed a new scale , as follows : —
On every £ 100 , where the premium is 10 s .. 0 3 From 10 s to 20 a ... ... 0 6 From 20 s to 303 1 0 From 30 s to 403 ... 2 0 From 40 ^ to BOa 3 0 From 503 to 60 s 4 0 Above 60 s ... 5 0 Some minor reductions are to be made on stamps for agreements , and on proxies for voting for tha election of railway directors . The next important reduction is to be made in the artiole of currants . These were now largely consumed in thia . country ; they were mainly importcdjfrom the Ionian Islands ; and tbe alteration is anticipated to be doubly favourable , both to the home consumer and the interests
of a dependency in which we have a special interest . The duty is to bo reduced from 22 s to 15 s per cv / t . This will lead to a loss of revenue amounting to . ;¦> lass than £ 90 , 000 ; but increased consumption is « xp ' ectedto counteract this . The duty on foreiga coffee is to be altered from& ^ d ., as fixed by the new tariff , to 6 dM leaving only a differential duty of 2 d . between foreign and colonial coffee . This reduction is to be accompanied by an increase of the duty on chicory , which at present is largely ased in the adulteration of coffee . The reduction of the duty on foreign coffee will cause a loss of £ 50 , 000 . The last article with whioh the Government propose to deal is wool , on which the duty iB to be altogether repealed , whith will cause a loss to the revenue of no less than
£ 100 , 000 . Altogether , the entire loss to the revenue which is anticipated will result from these various reductions is calculated at £ 400 , 000 . But there was another important matter , to which , though not formally before them , it was important he should advert , in censequence ol the general expectation whioh prevailed . He meant the article of sugar . Our treaty with Brazil will expire in November next ; and by this treaty we are bound to admit its produce on the same terms as those of " the mo 3 t favoured nations . " On the expiry of that treaty , the Government propose to admit the sugar of foreign countries , where it ia raiRed by free
labour , at a differential duty of 10 s ; which , as the colonial duty is 24 s ., will admit free foreign at 34 s . This would extend our trade with countries east of the Cipe of Good Hope , and enlarge our commaTce with China itself . Thi 3 neither involved a sacrifice of principle nor hostility to Brazil , for the reduction of the duty on coffee was a proof of the contrary . Their object was to prevent sugar , the produce of countries tainted with slavery , from being imported into this country . But he referred all details to the time when the annual Sugar Duties Bill will be discussed ; and concluded by congratulating the House on the cheering prospect of increasing prosperity which the state of the revenue afforded .
Mr . Hume , though admitting that the statement of the Chancellor of the Exchequer was clear and explioit , dissented from the policy pursued by the Government , especially on tho subject . of sugar , which he considered altogether a mistake ; and in the maintainance of large military and naval establishments during peace . Mr . Williams followed with similar comments . Mr . Bell called attention to the operation of the tax on exported coal , which he contended was injurious both to the ooalowner and shipowner .
Mr . Baring asked what would have been the state of the revenue had the income-tax not been imposed ! He thought that the Chancellor of the Exchequer should have stated distinctly whether or not , it waa to terminate at the end of the three years , or be continued for the full period of fiveyeaiB . fie commented on the proposed reductions of duties , approving of the reduction on foreign coffee , but disapproving of the intended increase on chicory , which , he understood , was largely mixed with bad coffee , and rendered it not only usable but cheap . These , however , were small matters ; not so the contemplated alterations in sugar . If they were really sincere in their abhorrence of slavery , they would not thus inconsistently and absurdly encourage it ; for , depend on it , every amount of free labour sugar taken oat of the European market would only leave a vacuum to be filled up by slave produce .
S . r R . Peel said , he was sure that if the Government had not availed themselves of the earliest opportunity afforded by the expiration of the Brazilian treaty to admit free-grown sugar , they would have been accused of an indirect attempt to keep up the West Indian monopoly . With reapect to what had been said by Mr . Hume and Mr . Williams about the reduotion of establishments , he appealed to the sense of the House , already , and almost unanimously , expressed upon the estimates of the present year . Though the operations in China and India might no longer require the same force which they required a year or two ago , that forco could not be dropped to a peace establishment instantaneously . He would undertake to convince any man of whatever party ,
except Mr . Hume and Mr . Williams , that in the presont circumstances of political affairs , it was quite impossible to make any sensible reduction of our naval and military forces . After referring to the details respecting the coal-duty introduced by Mr . Bell , and controverting the arguments deduced from them , he addressed himself to Mr . Baring ' s complaint , that the . Government had not announced ita intentions respecting the incometax .. Had the Government now declared an intention to continue the income-tax , they would have been told that there might be another surplus next year as gratifying as that which had already accrued and that in such an event there would be no need for any income-tax at all . He had notified in March ,
1842 , that there might ba a necessity to consider of the continuation of the tax at tho end of throe years , but not at the end of two . As this matter would and ought to be deferred till next year , tho Government would be blameable if it should now propose such reductions of taxes aa might make the renewal of the income-tax indispensable , instead of leaving it optional . The reductions now proposed were not of so large amount as to embarrass that question ; but the taxes to be thua reduced had been selected because they pressed with peculiar seventy upon the springs of indastry , because the removal of them was conformable to the principles laid down at the time of the tariff , and because the articles whose prices wonld be lowered by that removal were articles in extensive consumption by tha labouring
classes . , .. . Mr . Labouchere ? spoke warmly on the contemplated alterations of the sugar duties , which he considered would prove not oaly fatally impolitic in principle and example , but pernicious in operation . . . Mr . S . Woutley and Mt . P . M Stewart joined in tbe debate , the latter complaining of the effect which the proposed alteration of the isugar duties would have , aisd affirming that the foolish regulations of the Colonial-office alone prevented the West Indies from being able to compete with any part of thq world . > Lord Stanley defended the" Colonial -office and himself , contending tbat he had , since entering office , very considerably relaxed the restrictions on the emigration of free labourers , especially Coolies , to our sugar Colonies .
Mutual explanatians having passed between Mr . P . M . Stkwart and Lord Stanley , Lord John Russell did not think that the Government deserved all the credit claimed for it by Lord Stanley , of having been the first to allow the introduction of Coolies into the Mauritius . He reminded the House that there was a Vme . ^ n the Hill Cooly question served the Mimsteriahsta when in opposition just as effectually ^ s any other for obstructing the late Government . He did not nic ichd refto
S Kfce ; moralUy ^^ use admit Brazilian sugar , and yet-claimed ^ credit for giving greater facilities for ^ the mtroducuon of Braanian coffee . If wa interfered lirthis way , not onl ? between free and slave labour ; but between tha species of slave , wployment j ; our morality would become the nuisance of the world . He foresaw that the Goveriunetit wer < £ fast coming round to the Whig budget ; of 1841 , ? with a slight difference , which would eetve to « 6 ver their inconsistency for a year or two . f * ; ' ¦ 4 ck
Colonel . SiBtHOBP made iteBwraeteristic attaon Ihe ' "Whigs , ^ o , he ^ said , ^ ertf toriaed out never to come in again !; In this viewr he approved of the apprppriat ^ « aqotion ;* of the ? a ^ ty in ; ii n $ ^ riM ) Nm the Ch ' aic ^ oifQf the E ^ thedffitybn ' mirine ^ fitorJaoptt ^ Wy ^ v ^^ a ' , a tax " of * 2 PQ per o ^ irti ^ oii w ^^ W ^ J ^^ MWi obligedtoft * IfigijirHon . : ®§ pfeifti had prbwisyd The hoped ittrouip ^^ ^ J ^ gt ^^ R gentlemen opposite , who he feupe ^ woXftai ^* "JPw the ' stool of repentanctt for ^(^ icemSaofmiW t * euy ) $ & ; Ctaughtor . ) .. % -Wfy Jp ? W ( Continued in our eigim -J ^ 'fc ^ -M \ ' ¦ ¦ " : <^ £$ - % " >
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pn reference to thla affair the following letter has been pabliahed by Mr . PerrandJ— , " Carlton Clnb , April 27 .
" SiB—Tbe proceedings in the House of Commons being now- terminated , I think U a dnty I owe to my . self ta volunteer that explanation of the exact meaning my -word * at Leeda « ere intended- toxonTey » 7 irhicb . 1 should notfor , one moment have "withheld had joa made that personal and private application tome which has hitherto been , the invariable enstom . amongst gentletaen ,-in » t « ftd of ftdepting theiadirecland public Bobtm of iippeaifaig to Parliament ; - ? j . j ; -i ,-, ^ - - " -Against the eoorse you and others choae to . puriu I deemed it . my datyaa a BrrtLsc jobject to makera ffP'fftitntiop'J : stand * X protested against the Rightrf the House of Commons to interfere iosacb cases ; and had that Houae ventared to Assert soon power either by censoring me . or byjany other set of a tangible nature , it "ws * mj Intention to have resisted ench an assomp . tion © f powttos its psrt » aaa to b&ve tried that tight
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May 4 , 1844 . THE NORTHERN STABJ ' 7
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Citation
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Northern Star (1837-1852), May 4, 1844, page 7, in the Nineteenth-Century Serials Edition (2008; 2018) ncse.ac.uk/periodicals/ns/issues/vm2-ncseproduct1262/page/7/
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